Hey! Get your minds out of the gutter. I’m not talking about long ones of those. Although, that’s not a bad subject for another post. I’ve certainly come across my share of monstrous…er… parts in the M/M genre and wondered. But no, I’m not going there. At least not today. 🙂
Today I’m talking about long books (though I’m not averse to offering you a little eye candy while I do–heart-covered boxers on a hunky reader guy, yum!). You know, the big, thick ones (books, people…books!!) that you know’ll take you days, or if you’re a compulsively addicted reader like I am and can’t put down a good book once it’s started, long hours to read and savor. I’ve always liked long books myself, even as a kid. To me they’ve always offered the possibility of juicy and complex plots and characters, and the chance to really lose myself in another world.
Now, don’t get me wrong. I’ve certainly experienced my fair share of long books that have turned into tedious slogs that lost me in the mire along the way. But many of my favorite reads across all genres over the years have been hefty tomes–Stephen King’s The Stand, Diana Gabaldon’s Outlander, Margaret Mitchell’s Gone With the Wind, the Harry Potter books.
That love of depth has carried over into my writing as well. One of the first books I ever wrote topped out at 185,000 words. For comparison sake, it’s not as long as Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix, which is the longest of the HP books (word count: 257,045), but it’s pretty darn close to Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire (word count: 190,637). (Official word counts of the Harry Potter novels are provided by Scholastic Inc.) I ended up cutting out several thousand words–okay, like 50,000–before that particular book of mine was published, but compared to many novels, that’s still long. The average novel length for mainstream/genre fiction is usually 80,000-100,00 words.
I realize, however, that not all readers share my passion for lengthy tales. Some don’t even care for more moderate length novels and would rather pick up something they can start and finish in an hour or two, to which I say, more power to them! In fact, in the M/M genre, it often seems as if there’s a plethora of shorter works.
Most M/M publishers offer novels, but why, sometimes, does it feel as if a good chunk of this market is driven by short stories and novellas? In spite of my early leanings toward thick books, I genuinely enjoy writing novellas. I write novels, too. I don’t, however, like to write shorts–they don’t give me enough room to do character development the way I like. But many authors write shorts and do it well and the M/M industry is full of them.
Amber Allure, where my stories are published, offers everything from 5000 word short stories all the way up to full-length novels that approach or surpass 100,000 words. I think it’s a pretty darn good variety of choices to please most everyone. Here’s something interesting, though. Each customer receives a survey to fill out when they make a purchase that allows that customer to share his/her thoughts on their shopping experience. A common theme that comes up on those surveys is that many customers would like to see more long books–more novels as opposed to shorts and novellas. What’s curious, however, is that sales don’t necessarily corroborate that. If you look at the Amber Allure bestseller lists you’ll see that some novels do exceedingly well, but, in general, shorter works seem to hold the most appeal for a good chunk of readers. Speaking of my own books, while my novels have always sold very nicely in both ebook and paperback, many of my top selling stories have been novellas. And that’s not just at Allure…that’s across the board at numerous third party vendors as well.
So what’s up with that? Are readers eschewing longer works because they don’t have a lot of free time in their busy lives to delve into longer tales? Because of the cost? Or is it because readers prefer less involved stories that stick to the basics of, in this case, the M/M romance without getting into complicated plots? Because, as a writer, I speak from experience here when I say that it’s very difficult to write a complicated plot in a novella length story. (And you wonder why I write so many sequels. I sometimes can’t even cover all the ground I want to cover in novels and still have to write sequels!)
Which, actually, leads to another question I’ve often wondered about. Sequels seem to be hugely popular with readers. Would readers rather have one long book with a complex plot and in-depth characterization, or a series of short stories or novellas that tell the heroes’ tale and allow readers to get to know the guys slowly over time?
I’d love to hear your take on novels vs. shorts and novellas. What do you prefer to read, and why? Does the thought of a big, juicy novel fill you with joy and thoughts of long hours reading by the fire or on the beach? Or does it make you run for the hills? Authors, what do you prefer to write?
Lay it on me!
And for those of you brave enough to share your thoughts by posting a comment, I’ll be doing a giveaway. Or two. I’ll draw a couple of random names tomorrow, October 1st, and the winners can have their choice of any one of my currently available M/M books, in either ebook or paperback (if it’s available in paperback at this time). It’ll be the winners’ choice as to which they’d rather have.
Oh, and for those of you who have been wanting to know more about Fires of Ballian, the third book in the Draegan Lords series, stay tuned. I’ll be posting an excerpt today–the very first sneak peek at it.
ML 🙂
What a great post ML. Very thought provoking.
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I’m going to be infuriating and sit on the fence with this one :). Like you, I’ve read and loved books like Outlander or the Harry Potter books, and sometimes I like nothing better than to spend a few days on one book getting into complex world building and characterisation which these books often contain in spades. Long books also often have what I call little ‘aside’ scenes where two or three characters may get together and talk or interact, but the scene itself doesn’t bring the plot forward in any way. These scenes are there solely for comic effect or to allow the reader to get to know a character better. In novellas or short novels there isn’t the page space available for scenes like that.
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Having said that, since I started blogging I feel under pressure to read a set number of books a week so that I can review them. Long books can then become a drawback as they take longer to read and it’s at that point I turn to the quicker short stories and novellas.
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So, to sum up, yes I love long books, but I also love to read the shorter books as well. See, I told you I was fence sitting ;).
And you know, there’s nothing wrong with being a fence sitter. You get the best of both worlds that way. *g*
I’ve built plenty of fences in my time and crossed even more, but I’ve never sat on one, the barbed wire kind. And that thought is not a pleasant one either.
I am not a fence rider for the most part. I love long books!
In shorter books, some of the characterization is lacking. I love characters who are well developed. You laugh with them; you cry with them. You try to anticipate their actions and reactions and then they get to surprise you all over again.
Shorter books are OK. But I do not get invested in them as much. I do not usually wait around for the next book. If I find one from the same world, I will get it, but I don’t often hunt them down like a drug fiend.
But those good juicy long ones will have me hunting the next installment. Like a crack whore, I will be looking for the next one to fulfill my needs.
LOL! I know that feeling, Morana.
I am for longer books. Whenever I take them out from the library I seldom take something less then 250 pages. Because I read quite fast, I don´t like the book to finish too soon.
Short novels or novella´s just wet your appetite and then it is the end already. I don´t like that.
Then again some writers must know when to finish a series. I like sequels as any other but enough is enough.
Interesting you say that about sequels, Ingrid. I so know what you mean about saying enough is enough. There are a certain mainstream/genre authors I really love who write series, but once a series gets beyond five or six books, no matter how much I enjoy the author’s style and the characters, I find myself losing interest. I don’t know if it’s just too much of a good thing and I want to stop while it’s still semi-fresh and interesting, or if I get burned out. Probably some of both.
Great post, M.L.
I love long books. Like you, two of my faves are The Stand and Gone With The Wind. There’s nothing like falling face-first into the world of a book and knowing you won’t have to crawl out again for hours and hours.
But I tend to write short. My entire backlist is made up of shorts and novellas. I’m working on what will be my first published single-title length novel for Allure at the moment. It will likely only be around 80K words, yet sometimes it feels like I’m drowning in plot!
I have a lot of admiration for writers who can do the complex world-building necessary for really long novels – even non-paranormal contemporaries – without becoming overwhelmed. I hope to develop that skill someday. (Sooner would be better than later. Like…this afternoon? Please?)
I LOVE your writing, Selah, so I suspect you’re going to have a fabulous novel when you’re done! Even in your novellas your characters have depth and your stories have solid, intriguing plots.
But it is a shift, to go from writing in a shorter format to writing in a longer one. I had the opposite problem for a long time because I started off writing nothing but novels, long novels, so shorts and novellas were really tough for me to master. Just how much plot *could* I fit in a short space without going over word count. I still don’t manage to succeed at that every time. LOL! Most of my stories, even novellas, end up running way longer than I thought they would.
Aw, thanks, M.L. That’s just what I needed to hear today.
I think part of my trouble with writing long is my teensy attention span, which has been described as “a gnat on crystal meth.” I’m finding that if I keep a few shorter side projects going while I work on this longer novel, I get more done overall.
Speaking of which, back to the salt mines. 🙂
I truly admire authors who can work on several projects at a time. There are times I wish I could do that. I used to try, way back when, but I ended up feeling like I was dibbling and dabbling all over the place, but not able to focus and get anything decent written on any of the projects.
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In fact, my preferred way to write is to clear my schedule of absolutely everything else, shut out the world, then dive headfirst into writing a book and not come up for air until it’s done. Realistically I can’t always do that and I’m stuck having to write a little every day, but a story never flows as well for me unless I can do total immersion. I admit, it’s an exhausting way to work, but it’s also exhilarating. For me. LOL! But then I’ve always been one to gorge rather than pace myself.
I definitely prefer longer books, as they come with the promise of lots of room for plot and characterisation. If I love a writer’s style and the worlds they build, I want to stay in them a long time and be able to savour them. I rarely read short stories by choice, not even by my favourite novellists, and I find them really difficult to write.
I’m torn on novellas. I like writing them, and I usually enjoy reading them when I am reading them. But when I’ve finished I think “I wish there was more.”
Wow, Alex, you took the words right out of my mouth! This is how I feel about shorts and novellas, too. I rarely read short stories for pleasure. Novellas, on the other hand, I truly enjoy reading and writing. But after I’ve finished writing one, more often than not I, too, think, “I wish there was more.” So I end up writing a sequel. *g* Which isn’t a bad thing, I guess. But there’s always a part of me that feels kind of wistful that I didn’t just make it a novel to start with.
Jen
I understand what you mean. Some reviewers like the shorter books, and since I’m a slow(er) reader I can finish them faster than novels. However if I’m reading strictly for pleasure and there’s no review involved, I tend to go for the longer books. If the author is someone whose writing I love, the longer the book the better.
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ML
I tend not to like the very short books (60 – 70 pages or even longer) because the characters are mostly under-developed and the resolution of the romance seems forced to a large degree. This is, of course, a generalization because a few short stories that I’ve read beat the novels hands down. Writing short stories is an art and most of the writers today don’t seem to know how to engage the readers to the extent that they feel satisfied at the end of the book. Too many hanging threads and questions and unresolved issues don’t make for a very satisfying read. Novellas (at least 120 pages) are probably a good compromise
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I do love longer books but I don’t buy as many of them because, on too many occasions, at the end of the book I go WTF? because I wasn’t engaged and the writing sucked. If I love the author then I run to the bookstore to buy their latest novel and can’t wait to crack that baby open.
For me, as a writer, novellas are a good compromise. Shorts just don’t do it for me, and as much as I like writing novels, sometimes I want to be able to write a piece that’s more focused and straightforward that I can finish in a few weeks. I enjoy mixing up my writing schedule with some of both to keep things interesting.
I’m more for the middle ground, something say 3-4 hundred pages long is my favourite. (Though I have got War and Peace on my reading list for next year!)
But I’m flexible, which maybe comes from being a fanfic reader where stories are as long as they are, basically! There’s no proscribed length.
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I tend to only start a really long book if I know I’ve got plenty of reading time available, otherwise it just feels like it’s taking too long and I get frustrated.
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I’ve devoted entire days to reading long books before. Harry Potter ones actually, because if I didn’t get them read on the release date it wouldn’t be safe to venture onto the internet for fear of spoilers. That’s… an experience… I needed a lie down in a dark room after I did that with Order of the Phoenix.
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Shorter novels, or novellas that are in a series are okay by me, because I don’t get frustrated thinking I want more, because there is more! Yay!
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So really, I’d read any length, but what I don’t like is when the book is the wrong length for the plot. If it feels like it’s been stretched more than the plot can really support, or it’s skimming too fast over events that should be more drawn out.
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A book should be as long as it takes to tell the story effectively. And I think with ebooks there’s a lot more flexibility there than there is in paper publishing. The novella had almost vanished from paper format, but there’s loads of ebook novellas, so it’s back, baby! The challenge for writers of course is to write the novellas effectively. They are in the end different animals than novels.
I agree, junkfoodmonkey, that is one of the beautiful things about ebooks…so much more flexibility in length, in content, in genre cross-over. Frankly, that’s a good part of the reason I moved toward ebooks as a writer many years ago, as opposed to trying to break into a big NY publishing house. I don’t do well when I’m boxed in. I love the freedom to follow my muse wherever it leads. Which I’m able to do writing for a small press. I’m grateful for that every single day.
Hi M. L.,
Well, personally, I prefer longer books. This is reflected in my purchases both print and electronic. Both the character development, and the plots tend to be more in depth and thought out in longer books. I guess I’d say they feel more real.
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Series are another issue. I’m not a particularly patient person, so I’m not a fan of reading series until they are complete. Once complete I’ll buy the first one. If I like it, I’ll spend a weekend or more finishing the series.
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I’m not fond of waiting even a couple months for a sequel let alone a year or more. This doesn’t mean I don’t get caught sometimes. I do. It will happen that I think a series is complete so I pick it up. When it’s a series I really enjoy, I tend to end up frustrated, and I have a very hard time waiting for the next part.
In spite of the fact some have labeled me cruel *g* for not writing sequels immediately, as a reader, I’m much like you, Lynn. I like instant gratification, so I’d rather wait to read a series until all books are out. Then I can gorge (see, there’s that word again) on it all at once.
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I’m like that with TV series as well. I often wait, then get the DVDs and watch all the seasons in one big, delicious gobble.
I wouldn’t say “cruel”, I’d say “evil” given where you left Lords of Kellesborne… *g* I made the mistake of thinking the series was completed because the combined book was released. *sigh* More so, because I love the series, and I’ve been going slowly crazy waiting for Fires. lol!
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With TV series, I’m only like that any time there’s a multi-part episode, or 24. In those instances, I’ll record all eps before watching. lol!
I do think that ebooks are part of the reason we are seeing more short stories and novellas published as standalone pieces — they make it financially viable. To put a 20K novella out in print, it would look like a pamphlet. I really don’t think readers would be interested in buying that and what it would cost, proportionate to its length, is probably exorbitant.
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Prior to getting my ereader 18 months ago, I was pretty much an exclusive novel reader. But since then, I have become much more experimental with all kinds of writing of different lengths and much of what I have read I have enjoyed very much. I still love complex stories with vivid characters and lots of plot, but I have been very pleasantly surprised with what authors can create in 20K to 40K words.
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L
You make a good point, Leslie. I think ebooks have definitely grown the short story and novella market. In the days before ebooks, if you wanted to read short stories or novellas, pretty much your only option was to buy an anthology or maybe a magazine that published shorts. But now, thanks to the digital age, you can download just one story at a time if you choose.
I remember reading Manna Francis’ “The Administration” series and how I hated having to stop reading to cook, to sleep and go to work! LOL. Yeah, I love long books, as long as they are good. When I really like a story, I am always dreading to come to the last page, not wanting to let go.
If the novella/short stories trend you mentioned in m/m genre is true, then I am a bit of the opposite. I actually hesitate if I see a story that has less than 60 pages… but of course, I read tons of these too when they are in an anthology.
A long book is different from sequels or series though. It’s a bit like a 3-hour movie (Lawrence of Arabia?) vs. TV series (The Wire?), the structure and pace are so different. Both can be brilliant though.
So when you read anthologies, thelastaerie, do you prefer single author anthologies where all the stories are written by the same person, or multi-author anthologies?
I know anthologies, especially in the erotic romance world, are popular, so I’m always curious what attracts readers to them.
I don’t have a preference. Is that waffling? But really, I read the blurb (or the review) and if it appeals I read it. Sometimes I have no clue how long a book is until I’ve paid for it. Well, I obviously know that one that costs $7 is going to be longer than one that costs $2.50 but that doesn’t factor in to my decision to buy it or not. I don’t consciously (usually – see below) seek out books of a certain length.
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I do have to be in the right frame of mind to tackle a long one though. (SHUT UP!! You know what I meant!) I periodically go through something our dear Kris coined “toy poodle flu” where I just can’t seem to focus or concentrate on a longer book and therefore gravitate towards shorts that I can read in a couple of hours or less. I go nuts, read a bunch, then settle down to longer reads again.
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As for sequels, I would rather have it in one longer book to be honest. If two books are both 65 pages and come out a couple of months apart, I would rather just have waited and read 130 pages that took the story from start to finish. I’m not sure I want to get a 650 page story that rolls up a complex storyline into one book, there is a place for a “series” concept, but just writing “book 1 – they met” “book 2 – there is a conflict” “book 3 – HEA” I find a bit annoying. Just put it all together and stop with the teasing.
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And while people may like the concept of longer stories, they do cost more money. If you only have $12 to spend, you may choose to get 3 or 4 shorter stories to enjoy than spend it on 2 longer ones. Or the people who answer those surveys are a small segment of the buyers who don’t say “give me more shorts” because they get plenty.
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As an aside, I HATED Gone With the Wind. I wanted to slap Scarlet upside the head. Does this get me kicked out of some kind of club now that I’ve admitted that?
@Tam
“As an aside, I HATED Gone With the Wind. I wanted to slap Scarlet upside the head. Does this get me kicked out of some kind of club now that I’ve admitted that?”
Me, I like people who go against the prevailing opinion of characters in famous books. I spent half of Wuthering Heights thinking Heathcliffe should get a haircut and get a bloody job. And don’t even get me started on that complete git, Mr Rochester in Jane Eyre. On the other hand, Mrs Bennett in Pride and Prejudice is always being dissed and I love her.
/threadjack!
*whispers*
Psst, don’t tell anyone, but I’ve not actually read Gone With The Wind. I don’t even think I’ve seen the film all the way through either.
I’ve never seen the movie either Jen. Not really my style. No car chases or explosions. Oh wait, maybe there were explosions. 🙂
LOL! “Toy poodle flu.” OMG, I LOVE that phrase! As much as I like long reads, I confess I sometimes suffer from this myself.
And, no, you won’t be kicked out of any clubs, Tam. *g* I really like Gone With The Wind, but Scarlett is not one of my fave characters in the world. I understand her, but the urge to wring her neck has occurred to me more than once. 🙂
I am a lover of the long. Book. The long book. But only if I like it. Okay, that sounded way better in my head. But the thing is, if I like the story, the writing, the characters, the setting, then I want it to go on forever. Which is when I especially enjoy series, because then it seems they do go on forever (Although many series grow long in the tooth and I find myself wondering “Why am I still here?” But it’s like watching a dear friend grow old. You want to stick with them because they’ve been so good to you).
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What was I saying?
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When I got into reading m/m, I was frustrated with how short so many of those books were. I felt like I was just getting into the story and -boom- it ended. Almost any book over 50k words was an autobuy. But I read a few that really needed a judicious axing so I stopped getting all excited about the long. Became more discriminating. Now I find I appreciate good writing more than anything, and I can be pleased with short.
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What is the saying? It’s not the size of the pen, but the quality of the signature.
Well said, Wren!! 🙂
This is an interesting, thought-provoking post, M.L.
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I started reading shorter works when my kid came along because I could be sure to finish within a reasonable time frame. I’m a completist; I hate to put down an unfinished book! So for me, available free time factors into the decision about how long and thick I want to go. 😉
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An author’s style also plays a role: I know I can knock out a Charlaine Harris or a Janet Evanovich in an afternoon, but a Gabaldon book takes more of a time commitment. I’m several books behind in the Outlander series. 🙁
You know, I loved Outlander. It’s one of my fave books of all time. I enjoyed Dragonfly in Amber and Voyager. But I never could get through Drums in Autumn, and haven’t read any of the others that came after that. I think, for me, it was a case of the series starting to drag. And with Gabaldon’s books, they’re so long that it’s a serious time investment to read one. If I’m starting to lose interest in the series and feel like I’ve already gorged on all the really rich yummy stuff I like best, and if I start to feel like all that remains is the leftover whipped cream, then it’s hard for me to stay excited.
Outlander is one of my all-time favorites, too, M.L., and I, too, stalled out in Drums of Autumn. I have the rest of the books in the series, but rather than read them, I keep going back and reading Outlander over and over! Jamie Fraser remains one of my favorite fictional characters, especially the strapping young Jamie we get to know in Outlander.
He’s one of mine, too, Janey! I just love Jamie. *sigh*
ML, Thanks for an interesting topic!
I LOVE longer books. Like Alex said, I rarely read short stories because I am always left wanting more! Especially if it is a short story by an author I love. I may read a few short stories if they are sequels or prequels to longer books. I love to get lost in a big, juicy book!
Hey, Danielle! It’s cool that you’ll do that…read shorts if they’re sequels or prequels to other longer books. I’m not always so willing, and even though I know some short stories are out there that relate to some series I’ve read, I have a hard time working up excitement to go find them. I always ask myself why. Do I dislike short stories that much? Or is it simply that I don’t feel like I can possibly be missing all that much if I don’t read a short story that’s related, because how much ground can the author cover in a short anyway? I don’t know…maybe that’s a cop out on my part. I guess, in the end, when I’m reading, I’d rather have everything in neat, tidy packages. X number of books in order without any side gigs. If that even makes sense. LOL!
Shorter! I lose interest too quickly to read mass market paperbacks over 350 pages, with very few exceptions.
That said, I don’t care so much for short stories either, and I avoid anthologies. Stories under 75 pages often suffer from lack of depth, characterization, closure, etc. Yes, I’ve read lots of exceptional short stories/short novellas, but I don’t make a regular habit of seeking them out.
I think 75k words is my sweet spot. After that I start skim-reading and counting pages.
But I’m pretty sure we’ve already established that I’m kind of an oddball. 😀
I don’t think you’re an oddball when it comes to this, Jen. LOL! I like that 75K-85K word range myself in certain genres.
First, thank-you for this topic, it is something that really needs to be discussed. Personally, I like the variety, and tend to pick what suits me at the time. I buy the anthologies so I can pick up a quick short story if that’s was suits me and all I have time for. I tend to purchase the longer ones in paperpack so I can carry it anywhere (I love hiking, and stopping for a break in the middle of the forest with a great book). I buy the ones in between usually as e-books to read on breaks, or just kick back with my laptop. I do think there is a shortage of really good long m/m romances, and would love to see more. I don’t mean long as in filled with loads of description of what the sunset looked like, or with a bunch of other characters (I really don’t care much for too much time spent on other characters), but with real action and adventure, and interaction between the guys, both sensual, otherwise, and combined. As for sequels, some novellas are really just too short. The story ends abruptly when they finally just got together and I feel like I just started to get to know them, and they hardly interacted much in or out of bed… so I’m left feeling terrible wanting so much more. If I know there are sequels I buy them all at once if it looks like a couple and a story I’ll like. I’ve yet to see any story go into too many sequels, but then I’ve just been reading the best authors. I think someone with a good writing ability keeps me interested regardless, and I’ll buy the sequels. Speaking of sequels ML… there is one coming soon I hope, hint, hint…..
I’m writing and writing, LovelyPenquin. LOL! I promise!!
I had to think about this.
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I love longer books and never used to touch short stories at all. It’s only since I started reading m/m and/or ebooks that I have read novellas and anthologies at all. Not least because are also a good and not too expensive way of finding out if I like the writing of new authors.
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But I find an author I love, I often get frustrated with shorter works and just want to read a “real” book, i.e. a novel by him/her.
You know, I hadn’t thought about that, liade. It is a good way to see if you like a new author!
OMG, this is an interesting topic! Thank you for asking this, M.L. — I’m going to be very interested to watch the opinions pile up.
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I used to like long novels exclusively because I started out reading SFF and there a 500-page novel with a list of characters and a pretentious little glossary and a family tree is par for the course. Then I got into mysteries which made me like a tighter shorter plot, but some of those were still 300 or 400 page books.
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Then when I got into m/m ebooks, I really got to like the novella. I think a novella is defined as 70 to 159 pages, but I prefer them a little longer like 80-200 pages.
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This is a perfect length for me as a reviewer because I can read them fast enough to keep posting reviews on a timely basis, and yet there is enough plot and character interaction there to keep me involved. The price isn’t so bad either. And it’s usually a very streamlined read with a fast pace because it doesn’t have those little “asides” that Jenre mentioned.
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Short stories fascinate me sometimes because I know that to make them work, it’s all about focusing on the right moment where something small but definite happens. I like to see writers who know what they’re doing (and that doesn’t include me, ha, ha!) pull it off. But mostly, it’s too small a situation to interest me. I consider short stories to be a very advanced technique that very few of us can do all that well. Because of that, I’m like JenB, and I’ll avoid a lot of anthologies.
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I don’t think we see that many really long books in m/m because the contemporary romance plot can’t generate enough events to go on at that length without starting to seem repetitive or contrived. An m/m fantasy would be different.
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As far as sequels go, I’m totally with Tam in that I want each installment to be as stand-alone as possible. If the writer is ekeing out the various events book by book that could easily be put together into a longer work, then it seems kind of manipulative. Plus the writer will have to repeat much more of the context in every single installment to orient the readers.
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Like short stories, the whole series thing is a mystery to me. I see writers doing them successfully, but it looks like magic to me, ha, ha! I’m not sure how they pull it off though I can recognize it when I see it.
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Great topic, M.L.! Thanks again for bringing it up.
Excellent points, Val. What you said about contemporary romance plots really makes sense. In my opinion, it’s very difficult to write a contemporary m/m romance that has enough substance to carry it to a long length unless there’s a suspense plot or an urban fantasy plot or some other external conflict/additional layer to the story to flesh it out. Certainly there are exceptions, but generally speaking, I feel that’s true. So for basic boy-meets-boy-they-fall-in-lust-and-love plots, novellas work well.
ML
I always prefer the longer books or the series. Novellas are fun but they leave me hanging, and wanting to know more about the character’s world. They are often a great introduction to a new environment, almost like a trial period.
In the longer books, the characters seem more alive, more grounded.
I do like to read short stories, but I treat them like snapshots. That’s how I write them too. A moment, that is significant but only gives a glimpse into the lives of a few people.
That’s a great way to define what a short story should be, Marcella…a snapshot. Unfortunately, that’s not always the case in m/m stories, where some authors try to cram the entire history of the guys’ romance into 10-12K words. Those are the ones that are frustrating for me and leave me feeling unsatisfied because, with very few exceptions, everything from the characterization to the romance feels shallow.
– I have to confess that I’ve been guilty of this, too. Especially when I first started writing erotic romance. That’s how I learned the hard way that short stories don’t work well for my particular writing style. I think this is a common mistake many beginning writers make, just like I did. They think short means easy. But, in fact, I think well-written short stories are one of the most difficult forms of writing to grasp. If you want to read short stories written by a master, pick up some of Rick Reed’s shorts. Now there’s a man who knows what he’s doing! 🙂
Thank you ML, I will.:)
Great topic of discussion. I love long books for all the reasons already stated in regards to development of the story line and characters. I simply like the whole reading experience of sitting down and feeling the heft of a long book in my hands and turning the pages and settling in getting to know the characters and lose myself in the story. Shorter books can be fun to read but they tend to be the ones I pick up and put down between doing chores or running around, the ones I tote around to read while waiting at the doctors office etc. They also tend to be the ones I only read once and then pass along to a friend or donate to the library – though there are exceptions. It is a good way to find a new author that I enjoy reading. The longer books that I buy are usually the authors that I collect and already know that I will be keeping. I love sequels most of my keeper books are by authors who have kept the same characters coming back for years. I enjoy seeing the characters grow, how relationships and story lines play out over time, it’s like catching up with old friends.
I hadn’t really thought about it, but you’ve made me realize a lot of my “keeper” books are sequels as well!
I love long books as long as they are well done. The reading then can become something to savor, to prolong the enjoyment. Long books also give you a chance to learn about the characters in depth. That is not to say that some shorter novels don’t, but it is more of the difference between knowing someone for years as opposed to a newer acquaintances.
– As to your question about novels popularity vs. novella (shorter works) in my case in part is money. Shorter works are cheaper. Even though i love long books i usually wait till the 6.50 and up are on sale, until i can use a club discount, or a free read is available. I read fairly quickly and can’t afford to buy every new book that peaks my interest. (i have a long list of eventually buy books though).
Hey, Tara! Yes, sales are definitely a good way to stock up on longer reads!
I much prefer long books. I read really quickly and can easily get through a 300-page book in a few hours. I’ll spend an entire day in a bookstore, not just scanning the first chapter of a book but reading the whole thing, and then I’ll buy them so I can read them again. I’m careful with ’em, I swear!
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I also love series, within reason. I prefer the author to have a plan for their series (like J.K. Rowling with Harry Potter), and bring it to an eventual end. I hate it when a series stretches out so long it becomes apparent that the author has lost interest and doesn’t know how to finish it anymore (hello Robert Jordan). If a series continues indefinitely, each book had better more or less stand alone.
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With e-books, it seems to me that some publishers have a rather loose idea of what “novel-length” is. It’s a bit disappointing to pay $7 and get less than 200 pages. It’s also disappointing to buy a “series” of short stories or novellas that could easily have been a single novel. I feel like the publishers are breaking up full-length stories just to get more money overall. Of course, this is a time-honored tradition in publishing, but it’s still irritating. Never stops me from buying ’em though. 😉
I wonder how many shorts and novellas that end up with sequels, though, aren’t a publisher decision as much as an author decision. And an unplanned-ahead-of-time decision at that. I know I’ve written several novellas and novels that I initially intended to be stand-alones, but then after I finished them, ideas came to me for sequels.
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I think this happens with many authors. Either the characters won’t leave them alone and pester for more, or the initial story was well-received by readers and readers ask for more. For me, I’d say more than half of my series have been unplanned…meaning I didn’t make the decision to write another story or two or three until I was well into the first one, or finished with the first one.
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I’d be curious to know if this is the case with other authors. But I suspect I’m not alone in having a wandering, impulsive muse. 🙂
Interesting topic. As much as I can tell from the other posts, there seems to be a small advance towards longer books. The same is true for me.
Only since I started to read m/m, primarily ebooks, I have read novellas in the first place. With “real” books I always went by the rule the longer the better. I hated to leave a world just when I got acquainted with the characters and the setting. Especially when it comes to fantasy, of which I used to read a lot. LOTR is exactly my kind of length.
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As for sequels, though, I feel the same others in this post hinted at. Sometimes enough is enough. One example comes to mind, the Black Dagger Brotherhood series by J.R. Ward. I extremely loved the first five books, but then somehow got fed up with the repetition. (There are only so many ways how you can tell the story of how the vampire warrior meets his destined mate, almost looses her to cruel fate and wins her back by virtue of his…whatever. I get off the track here.) Also with the Harry Potter Series; the two last books were so long and so fraught with unnecessary side plots and reiterations I couldn’t help but think there’s no one left who dares to actually edit Mrs Rowlings.
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With m/m, in my opinion, sometimes it is not that easy to find a book with a good plot to begin with. And when it comes to shorter works, it seems to me that there is even less of a decent plot; maybe it’s really due to the word count. But, on the other hand, I HAVE read brilliant short stories, so it seems to be doable.
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In general I am with Tam when it comes to purchase. I read the blurb, I like it, I buy it and only then realize what length it is. But usuallyI tend to avoid anthologies.
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I’m a very fast reader so the sheer length of a book doesn’t scare me. Although sometimes I spend time reading I really better should spend sleeping…Novellas and short stories sometimes are like gummy bears: delicious, but gone too fast.
I so share your affliction about reading when I should be sleeping. LOL!
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Thanks for all your great insight, Feliz! You make a lot of good points. I really didn’t read novellas and shorts either until I started reading erotic romance and erotica and fanfic years ago. Before that it was all about long books for me, too. As was mentioned earlier, I think the Internet has really fueled an explosion of shorter fiction, which is pretty cool. I think it’s opened up a lot of genres to reader who might not ever have known about them.
I much prefer a nice long novel that takes days or an overnighter to read. I accept novellas as a fact of life and rarely read short stories. I read a lot fairly quickly, so short stories just don’t work well for me. Serial shorts really piss me off. I simply won’t buy them. Once I did a little math and figured out what I was spending for a short novel, I stopped buying them. There simply isn’t room in the budget for crap or filler.
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Usually when I *don’t* buy a novel it’s because of price. If an e-book costs the same as a paperback and you’ve been snookered before by “novels” of 90 pages of poorly edited crap… I’m a little leery. If it’s a tried and tested author though, crack whore is a great description!
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For sequels, if the premise is that the HEA in the last book ended, I don’t buy. I’m disappointed that my HEA isn’t ever after. If it’s a HFN and the character has moved on to his HEA, I’m all over it. Love & Loyalty for example, was a temporary relationship and the character moved on to HEA. I waited for that one like a junkie looking for my fix. The tedious and never ending series is trickier. Terry Pratchett has kept me hooked on Discworld by keeping the series fresh and varied, so I buy all of them. Piers Anthony lost me as a teenager and Patricia Briggs has me back to addict territory. It all depends on the work itself. Now if Josh Lanyon finds another AE story, how would I resist? I’d love to see those guys as an open couple in just one more story…
Amie I am right there with you on the HEA. That bugs me, too, if the HEA in one book gets tossed by the wayside in a sequel. Couples who are meant to be together can have problems and insecurities and outside conflicts that can cause uncertainties between them in a sequel. But, man, do not, after you’ve sold me on a couple’s HEA, tear them apart completely and have them find new lovers. I don’t even like it when another man or woman is introduced into the mix and the couple becomes a threesome.
“It all depends on the work itself. Now if Josh Lanyon finds another AE story, how would I resist? I’d love to see those guys as an open couple in just one more story…”
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Soul mates. I know AE 5 is only a couple of months away, but I’m not convinced it will show Jake and Adrien as an “open couple”.
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No, I most certainly do not want a churned-out-indefinitely Adrien series, but I’m convinced one more volume is not enough to show Jake as comfortable-in-an-openly -gay-relationship.
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Though actually IMO no number of sequels could establish that credibly anyway. So maybe Josh knows best, after all.
I prefer long books. My favorite books of all time include Jean M Auel’s Earth’s Children books, and Elizabeth Moon’s stories about Paksenarrion.
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But like LovelyPenquin, I like variety and often read what suits me right now. A novella or short story for a quick read, long novels on lazy Sundays.
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I’m much like Tam when purchasing books, at least online, that I read the blurb and decide, and realize later that I haven’t looked at the word count and I get at surprise when I open the book and see the length.
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I’m always looking for interesting long m/m reads, but I often find it hard to find. It’s a lot easier to find novellas and anthologies in the genre that tickles one’s fancy.
I guess maybe part of the reason shorts and novellas are so popular is because they are so available. So even readers who enjoy longer reads, buy a lot of shorter pieces because they’re easier to come by.
Well, I like the longer books too. I like Clancy and Cussler and recently I’ve thought that M.L. writes similarly to both these authors with the complicated plots and subplots upon subplots. And I think the world she has created in the Draegon Lords books is very close to the world Tolkien created in the Lord of the Rings.
When I look to buy a book, the cover is something that catches my eye first. So, please have plenty of skin on display. grin
*Smooch* Thanks, John! And as you already know, I like Clancy and Cussler, too. What about Ludlum? Have I asked you that before? I still adore the Bourne series, even before Matt Damon played him in the movies (although…yum!!).
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I agree about covers. I think many people do, indeed, buy books based on covers, so they’re important. And, yes, skin is nice. I’ve never been one of those readers who’s offended by sexy book covers. Even back in the glory years of romance, when there used to be such a hoo-haw about clench covers. I always liked them myself. And I like m/m book covers that show some skin, too. I’m a visual person, so I like to look at pretty things. 🙂
i’m gonna wade in and say that i think that longer books frankly add a bit of legitimacy to a form – one of the criticisms of m/m novels, romance novels, and m/m erotic romances.
and, i like to chew on a story’s details. those details aren’t available in a short story.
-kkm
Like others, I never used to read shorts or novellas until I began reading ebooks and found that many of the books available came in these formats.
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My preference – and I think a large part of this is due to the fact that I’m a great lover of the fantasy genre – is definitely for long books and by this I mean anything with 300+ pages. I find myself more able to ‘lose’ myself in the story when it’s a longer piece of work. I feel a deeper sense of connection for having travelled on a more developed journey with the characters and therefore the reader payback is better for me… if that makes sense. 🙂
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As implied above, this doesn’t mean, however, that I only buy books with a high word count. I buy the ones that appeal to me as a reader, whether that be via the book cover, the blurb, the excerpt, a review/recommendation, whatever.
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I’ve also discovered that short stories and novellas are good for those bouts of toy poodle flu (thanks for the shout out, Tam ;)). That is, when all you are in the mood for is a few quick reads because anything else is too ‘meh’ – for wont of a better word – to be able to focus on.
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Whether some authors should be writing short stories or novellas is another matter entirely. If anything the number of books I’ve now read in this format have proven to me that as much as it takes skill to author a long piece of work it takes just as much to write a short and make it convincing for the reader. I often think that the shorter works are the more unforgiving of the two. My 2c anyway.
Many writing classes instruct starting the story as close to the end as possible. Some novels start five steps from the finish line, while short stories start a foot away. It’s not all about complex plots or page count, but the changes to the main character. It’s the difference between a bite of orange sherbet and a tall glass of orange juice. Some short stories I’ve read leave a brighter, more lasting impression than novels or novellas. That’s why I’m all over anthologies or collections. There are always a bright few in the bunch, and they make the money worth it, especially the Hell Cop anthologies. ^_^
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On that note, I’ve recently read “The World’s Shortest Stories”, a bunch of 55 word stories, and they work because everything is summed up in one moment. Short stories could be great if polished by the right person.
Like a lot of other people I also don’t like the shorter stuff cause I don’t get as emotionally involved and attached. It’s going to take an incredible author to make me care about someone in a short. It does happen but I much prefer to take my time and get to know the characters deeply.
I’ve always loved long books and have only come across a few books where I thought the author carried the story for too long. But I’ve always felt that was due to sloppy writing, like they couldn’t decide how to end it so just kept adding things on.
I’ve only started reading series in the last few years and yeah, I don’t like to wait. In fact, I go back and reread the books previous, before reading the new one. A habit I’m going to have to break as I start reading more series because more and more of my time is taken up by reading books I’ve already read.
So basically if they can fit two stories into one large book, I’m all for it. But if it’s something like they can’t decide how to get to the HEA or they get to the HEA and then include new problems just for a chapter or two, that’s when I think the book is too long. And page count has very little to do with it.
p.s. I adore your stuff! And I’m sort of boggling that one of my fav authors is blogging with me. 😛
Thank you for this good post. I really love this tv series. Can’t wait for the next season ! Keep up the awesome work with this 🙂
Someone from http://www.sharepal.com told me to have a look here for the blurays that they don’t have in store, but it seems this isn’t the right site…would you happen to know if they could have been talking about some site that has a similar name to this one? Any help would be appreciated!