Not a day goes by that my dear former Facebook friend Jamie LeBoink doesn’t send an invitation out asking people—everyone, anyone–to “like” her and her writing. I think she was up to about 1500
friends at the point I disengaged. And three of those 1500 folks might actually, eventually buy Jamie’s writing, assuming she ever gets around to doing any.
My point is not that LeBoink is an idiot and that we should all boycott her. My point is that we all do stupid stuff when we’re starting out in this business. We spam our friends and family. We write reviews for ourselves. We argue with reviewers. Just like a baby sucking his toes, we don’t know any better.
Nobody is born knowing the ins and outs of publishing and promotion. Having that first book come out is sort of like landing on a planet in outer space. Is there any other life here? Are the natives friendly? Do they eat little boys and girls like you for lunch? You watch, you follow, you learn. And often how you learn is by making mistakes.
Those of us who have been stranded here a while will watch, struggling to keep a straight face, as you stagger around the dunes and fall into the very same quicksand pit we did. And some of us will offer a helping hand. And some of us won’t. But very few of us will change the sign on the path leading to the quicksand so as to guarantee you fall in.
While we may not start out knowing that it’s not kosher — no, not even if you go months without a single review on Amazon — to write reviews of our own work (or even tell your mom what to write), we do all know it’s not okay to hurt someone else. We do all know that actions motivated by spite and jealousy and pettiness are not okay. We certainly have the survival smarts to know that if it’s something we’d be embarrassed about having made public, it’s Not Okay.
That’s the topic of today’s post. The fallacious and ultimately self-destructive idea that you have to play dirty tricks on other authors in order to get ahead in this business. The mistaken notion that Everyone is Doing It.
Yeah. Right. And nobody ever expects the Spanish Inquisition.
Imagine if you will, Robert Crais and Michael Connelly putting their heads together and writing a bunch of one star reviews of all Robert Parker’s books as part of some misguided strategy for success.
I know. I can hear the snickers from here. Not because we’ve all been there and done that, but because it’s so…lame. That behavior is pathetic and we don’t think of real professionals, and definitely not successful professionals, having to resort to that kind of thing. Successful is not desperate, and trying to blackball the competition is desperate.
So when we snicker as we hear of authors in our genre writing bad reviews of other authors (and, yes, we do hear this because it’s a very small fishbowl) whom they believe are too popular for their own good, we’re not laughing with you. We’re laughing at you.
It’s so…Snidely Whiplash trying to sabotage Dudley Do-Right’s jalopy.
Part of why we laugh is because we all recognize the feeling. The frustration that others are getting an unfair amount of attention or help, the secret belief that somehow our act of spite will help even the score. Literary types though we are, a lot of us are also ambitious and competitive and it’s hard not to view our publishing success as some kind of race, even though logic tells us this is not so. Someone else’s failure does not equal our success — or vice versa.
Never mind the fact that it’s bad for your soul when you give into the temptation to act on your jealousy and fear and insecurity, never mind the karmic backlash — maybe you don’t believe in souls or karma or practicing random acts of kindness. The main reason you don’t want to give into practicing Stupid Author Tricks is because they don’t work.
That’s the other reason most of us laugh at the idea of Messrs. Connelly and Crais ganging up on the competition. It’s a dumb idea. It’s Wile E. Coyote brooding over his new Acme DIY kit.
And the reason that I keep bringing up cartoon analogies is because if you think, for example, nominating yourself for an award and then voting repeatedly through anonymous hotmail accounts is a great idea, you’ve got the tactical smarts of a ten year old.
I’m not going to pretend that success in publishing is all fairness and equality and only the good shall triumph in the end. Yes, the two key ingredients are skill/talent and hard work, but promotion is a big part of success in this game. So is luck. I won’t lie to you. I’ve had a lot of luck. But I’ve also worked my ass off — and I’ve been doing it for many years. You want to know the secret to my success? Two things. Focus and Sustained Effort.
So let’s talk about the most popular dirty tricks that naughty authors play on their colleagues, and I’ll explain why they don’t work and why you want to steer clear of the authors who practice this crap.
Now the overarching reason you want to run a mile if someone suggests you engage in things like stuffing ballot boxes is, if you’re going to do something unethical and embarrassing, you don’t want witnesses — and you sure as hell don’t want accomplices.
People have big mouths in this business — in any business — and friends come and go. You want to be careful who you trust, and I would suggest that you not place a lot of trust in someone who is urging you to do unethical and underhanded things. The true test of character is not how we treat our friends, it’s how we treat our enemies.
Okay? Pretty obvious, right? Let’s move on to the actual charges against the accused.
1 – Writing reviews for your own books.
I’m trying to look severe here, but this is really kid stuff. I’ll settle for putting a frowny face on your chart and benching you at recess. Come on. Yes, it is bad news not to have a single review on Amazon — or worse, a sole three-star (or lower) — but faking reviews doesn’t change the fact that no one has read your book and been moved to comment. So you writing a review — even if you try to be honest in your “review” — doesn’t change that.
You want to treat the disease, not the symptom. You want people to read your book and write reviews. How do you do that? You offer books for review. You stipulate that the reviewer must promise to review, but that you want an honest review. You assure them you will not ask to see the review first, etc.
I know. You’re thinking…what if someone writes a negative review? That’s still better than no review and everybody won’t write a negative review. Most people write positive reviews. In fact, most people think they’re writing positive reviews even when they’re writing negative reviews. Relax about the whole review thing. You just need enough of them so that other readers can see that pioneers have safely crossed the no man’s land of your pages.
Again, offer books. If you’re a new author, give away a lot of books — try and give them to people in exchange for fair and honest reviews. Look at the cost of these giveaways as advertising.
2 – Writing reviews for friends’ books.
There isn’t a problem with this unless you’re trying to pretend that you’re an objective reviewer — or you haven’t actually read the book. I write reviews for my friends and I don’t hide the fact that they are my friends.
One friend writing numerous reviews of the same book on the same site? See #1 above. Stacking the deck doesn’t help the fact that no one is sitting in on your card game. If you want to help your friend — really help her — look up review sites for her and help her send copies of her book out.
Generally when authors write “reviews” for friends, they’re called blurbs. They go on the cover of the book, and the reader can take them with a grain of salt or not. Sometimes friends do interpretative dances for friends, but that’s another post.
Note to professional reviewers: Friends do not review friends. Why? Because you will either be too harsh in an attempt to appear unbiased or you will be biased by friendship. Or maybe you honestly hate your best friend’s book and you’re dumb enough to say so. A true friend puts her friend’s ego before her own.
3 – Exchanging reviews with other writers.
This isn’t a problem if the books are really read and if there was not an unspoken (sometimes spoken) understanding that only positive reviews will be exchanged. Is it unethical? Maybe mildly so in some Utopian author universe. I will say it’s a fairly common, if essentially useless, practice.
Why is it useless? Because it’s always the same circle of people reviewing each other in pretty much the same places, and so if their other promotional efforts are paying off, they’re all recognized to be other writers. Today’s readers are much savvier and they spend a lot more time socializing with us on the net, so they basically recognize the maneuver for what it is.
Reviewing books you haven’t read? Just say no.
4 – Amazon tagging more popular authors with your name or your book title.
This can be a solo operation or a number of authors banding together to target and tag. The theory behind it is a sort of roughneck Readers Who Like This Might Also Like That.
At one time the Adrien English books had something like 47 tags for a new mystery release by a then-unknown (and still largely unknown) m/m author. My own titles at that time only averaged about 12 tags, so it was obvious something was up. Most readers don’t bother to review, let alone tag, yet here was an author with a new release that more people thought was like the Adrien English books than the other Adrien English books!?
Although this is an essentially harmless move, the gall of it irritated me enough that I complained to Amazon, and the tags were removed, which I think explains why it’s not a useful tactic. It also had the effect of turning me off this author’s work — and that distaste lingers to this day.
5 – Writing negative and hostile reviews of other authors as part of your strategic plan. Or playing the ubiquitous Goodreads star system.
Usually under anonymous or a fake name, right?
Peek-a-boo! I seeeee you! Where do I start? Never mind the fact that this is neurotic and negative behavior and you probably want to get that looked at, these reviews always have that…whiff of sour grapes to them. Which means readers automatically, if unconsciously, discount them.
But the main reason why this is a mistake is because once again you’re treating the symptom and not the disease. The problem is you feel like here’s new author Angelika Mouse getting all this attention and help and she’s dangling her prepositions all over the place while you, YOU, who have been slogging away since the Ice Age, can’t get arrested if you ran naked through the halls of GayRomLit. You address that by taking Ms. Mouse down a couple of stars on Goodreads and maybe writing an anonymous nasty review or two instead of analyzing why she’s getting the response she’s getting.
What you ought to be asking yourself is not how can I destroy her, but rather, what is she doing that I’m not — and is there anything I can learn from her success?
Maybe yes, maybe no. One thing for sure, if your attention is focused on another writer’s popularity instead of your own writing, you’re looking in the wrong place. Removing Ms. Mouse from the equation will change nothing for you. Not one single damned thing. Didn’t you read any Grimm’s fairytales when you were growing up? Quit carrying on like the ugly elder step-sister.
6 – Force-feeding your Goodreads groups and Facebook pages to anyone who’ll bite.
This is on a par with culling names from discussion lists you belong to and force-subscribing them to your author mailing list. I don’t know if it’s unethical so much as bad manners — the latter’s even worse, to my way of thinking.
Most of us are using Facebook in a way it was not originally intended. We’re using it as a promotional tool. A reader “friends” me, I “friend” the reader back. It’s reciprocal. A lot of this friending is author-to-author, and that’s great. We’re networking. That’s part of the job — in fact, that interaction is one of the perks of the job — but there’s a fine line in social media and it’s easy for newbies (in particular) to trip over it.
You invite people to join your mailing list and your Goodreads groups and your Facebook Fan Pages. Now, I don’t know about you, but where I come from an invitation is generally not a fist wrapped in my collar and someone yanking me across the threshold and locking the door behind me. I think of that as more like abduction…or maybe holidays at my Aunt Marie’s, but either way, not something I’m going to put up with from a fellow author.
I think there is a misconception that being able to show a lot of “friends” on Facebook will make you look popular and so people will pay more attention to your posts. When I see an m/m writer with 2000+ friends gained within a month I see someone who did mass invites. That’s what we all see because we all know how it works.
There’s no harm in this, but there isn’t a lot of use either. You want your mailing list to be made up of readers and friends who are genuinely interested in you and your work. That way there’s a much better chance that they’ll read your posts and check out your books than if they just automatically friend everyone who friends them.
You invite people and if they don’t accept the invitation, you let it go. Maybe you wait a few months and invite people again, but you don’t, day after day, keep asking the same people to like your page. Oh, you’ll get 1500 people to “like” your page but they’ll never read the damn thing or comment on any of your posts or buy anything you write. They’re not there for you. They’re there because it’s polite to friend people back.
That politeness thing? Brush up on it.
7 – Nominating yourself for awards
See also Voting for Yourself and Judging Your Own Work under Publishing No-Nos.
In fairness, there are some awards you have to nominate yourself for. If you’re self-published you’ll have to nominate yourself for stuff like the Eppies and the Lammies. You don’t nominate yourself for reader awards. End of story.
Yeah, I can hear the whining now. But it’s always the same people getting nominated! No. It’s not. Sure some of the same people get nominated every year, but the winners are just as often newbies. Why? Because of the very thing you’re crying about.
Trying to rig reader awards requires the investment of anonymous votes and haranguing friends and strangers on lists you frequent. That’s a lot of work. You’re probably turning off as many people as you are earning votes. Plus, winning by such means doesn’t change the fact that you are not a reader favorite. And trying to convince readers they love you when they don’t, is not only self-defeating, it’s self-destructive.
Yes. Self-destructive. Because you’re the one and only person who believes that win should mean something. You are destined to be disappointed. Why? Let’s say you rig the Golden Café Speckled Trout award and you win. YAY!!! Now you go around announcing that win everywhere, and maybe a couple of readers decide to give your work a try based on you winning that award. YAY!! And the readers like your book. YAY! And…so what?
There are now dozens of these little awards and they all work to one end — and it’s the same exact end that all promotion aims for — to get people to try your work. Once they try your work, they either like it or they don’t. That’s the same result you’d have had if one of your banner ads or one of your excerpts had moved a reader to buy your book. And you wouldn’t have had to sell your soul for it. Winning these awards, while lovely for the ego, will not change the course of your publishing career. I know mainstream authors who’ve won major genre awards — and they were still dropped by their publishers. So do you honestly think winning the Golden Café Speckled Trout award is going to put you on the map? Or that it was worth cheating to win?
Promotion does make a difference, but if you think all publishing success is strictly about promotion, you are both sadly cynical and ridiculously naïve.
8 – Bullying, brow-beating, or otherwise coercing another author to engage in any of the above behavior.
If we want this genre to be taken seriously, we need to stop conducting business in the playground. If you’ve been around long enough to pick up some of these tricks, you’ve been around long enough to know better. Trying to force other authors into joining you in your bad behavior doesn’t legitimize the bad behavior. It means you’re a fascist on top of everything else.
If you want to make bad choices for yourself and your career, go ahead, but don’t drag others down with you. And you young’uns, don’t let yourselves be badgered into doing things that make you uncomfortable. I guarantee you that Everybody is NOT Doing It.
Can you damage your career by being caught engaging in any of this behaviour? Um…honestly? Probably not irretrievably in this particular very young, very brash publishing niche. But if your literary aspirations stretch beyond getting published with Big O Press, yeah. You do not want your prospective editor at HarperCollins reading the five-year-old thread where you get called out for backstabbing other authors. Very few people find cutthroat behavior appealing, and the competition for mainstream publishers is much, much stiffer. You don’t want to get nixed because you look like a whack job.
When it comes to how you conduct yourself in this genre, always try to behave as though you already were the big name you plan to be. Don’t give into jealousy, insecurity, frustration.You honestly think Robert Parker nominated himself for awards or sat around checking and re-checking the competition’s Amazon stats or wrote nasty anonymous remarks in the comment sections of online articles about other authors? I don’t think so. Ask anyone who knew him. They’ll tell you he was one hell of a writer and a very nice guy.
Take the high road. The trip may be a little longer, but the scenery is nicer and the air is a lot fresher.
Josh Lanyon’s Contact Information
website: http://www.joshlanyon.com/
email: josh.lanyon@sbcglobal.net
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoshLanyon
http://jgraeme2007.livejournal.com/
As Nancy Reagan said: “Just Say No!”
Wonderful advice Josh, and damn witty as usual 🙂
Hey thanks, Cole! If I can supply a few chuckles with the ruler over the knuckles, so much the better.
Oh my gosh! All I can say is I had no idea. This is really the only site I go to to get reviews and see what is going on in the m/m market. I have a few author pages and blogs on my favorites @ home that I check out randomly (yours of course among those.) I honestly don’t look at ratings on amazon or goodreads or any place else. I do buy all my ebooks for my kindle on amazon so maybe I should check the tagging out. I guess people are people no matter their careers. Sounds like what I deal with @ my office. Great post Josh very interesting.
This is why most of those promotional tactics are futile on top of naughty-naughty. What works best is a mix of promotional efforts — guest blogging, running ads, taking part on discussion lists, writing articles, etc. The most important thing (I think) an author can do is take time to interact with readers — and I don’t mean hard sell them — I mean interact with them, meaning treat them like friends rather than customers.
Most of this bad behavior focuses on other authors rather than reaching out to readers.
I do admit I am more faithful to authors who are very interactive. My go to authors are those that have actually become real live people to me. Interestingly enough you all are m/m authors. Authors outside of this genre I don’t even try to interact with because I feel like there is no point since they wouldn’t respond back in such a personable way.
Honestly, Lisa, I think most authors today understand that there’s an expectation that they will be accessible — although it isn’t quite the necessity it is with small press and self-publishing.
But the publishing world is changing all the time.
You are the voice of reason once again Josh.
As a newbie writer you can’t afford doing negative things. The m/m world, although expanding, is so small, you will get caught sooner or later.
I am a bit like a mule, if people tell me to do/read Thing A, I will do/read Thing B or nothing at all. A lot of the tactics described above will not work on me.
Ingrid, that’s the thing. It is a small community, and word does spread.
Maybe that size thing is part of the reason some people believe they can operate invisibly here or that what happens here won’t affect one’s writing career later on.
What I’ve found is most bad behavior will be forgiven — it’s true that people have a short memory (although the internet doesn’t) but crazy behavior — behavior motivated by jealousy, rage, hate…that stuff doesn’t get forgotten.
Maybe it’s our survival instinct. We know that crazies are dangerous and so we tend to remember them longer.
Very interesting to read about all this! I hate it the most when authors rate or review their own books. They are allowed to do it, but it still iritates me. I do like it when an author tells something about his book and posts links to reviews written by… well, not him- or herself 😛
Thank you for the insightful and witty post, Josh. In the past year, I’ve become involved in a number of author groups and become a follower of a number of blogs and I’ve seen a lot of the type of behaviors you’ve described. There was one award where a couple of authors were basically bribing people to vote for them. Yes, it wasn’t against the rules, and yes, they won the award (if I remember right they took 1st and 2nd place), but they lost me as a reader, forever. It left a really, really bad taste in my mouth. As you said, people notice and people talk and once on the net, it will remain for others to see for pretty much forever.
Susan, it’s still a very young genre. A lot of the authors here are still cutting their milk teeth. The only previous publishing experience they’ve had is in fandom. That’s not to slam fandom, but I do think that we all learn by observing what the more experienced around us are doing and advising.
I’m sure that there are many who think that all successful writers engage in these behaviors. Or if not these behaviors, other unknown but equally underhanded behaviors. It never fails to fascinate me that the last — always LAST — thing any writer wants to consider is the writing itself.
For some reason the idea that the secret to our lack of success might lie in the type of stories we want to tell or even the way we choose to tell them, is just terrifying.
I suspect fandom is the place where many of these bad habits are first picked up. It can be a horrendously bitchy place, although much of the trouble is usually caused by just a few people with an axe to grind. I won’t have anything to do with it anymore.
Huh, I guess I shouldn’t be surprised by this Josh, but I was shaking my head while reading – after chuckling at the funny bits. Don’t these people remember what happens to Wile E. Coyote? Karma, man!
But seriously in this day and age of the internet and instant access to information, everyone in the public eye (and even those not so much) should be aware that nothing they do is a secret for long. Even if there is no concrete proof, people talk – even people who they think are friends. And as you say people are far more savvy. Thanks for the entertaining and eye opening post!
Thanks, TJ. As I said somewhere else, most people are actually very forgiving about the mistakes we all make (especially those made when we’re young and dumb), but there’s something about attacking others–bad behavior motivated by pettiness, spite, mean-spiritedness or just plain old jealousy that is a real and permanent turn-off. Maybe it’s just a litte too naked.
Josh, I really appreciate your emphasis on doing the right thing; it is good for the soul, or at the very least, one’s conscience. Having said that, you know I’m not a writer, but I’m on this web-site and yours often enough to realize that being an author, new or otherwise, is a very difficult job. Thank you for your sage advice.
Patty, it is a difficult job, and it’s natural that writers hope to find shortcuts, hope to speed up the process–and that they convince themselves that this is what everyone does.
Just like those people who drive on the shoulder of the road try and convince themselves that they’re the only ones who thought of it, and that if anyone else had thought of it, they’d do it too.
I can’t brow-beat anyone? Damn
Just kidding *g*
Seriously, a great post and it’s common sense to not do those things.
I am a firm believer of venting to a friend. Sometimes you just need to let it out in a safe environment(not public). But to actually do anything underhanded or unethical, no.
YES. That’s what our writing friends are for. Theirs are the shoulders we cry on, the ear we bend, the one guest blog we’re assured of. 😉
The other stuff…well, it takes a toll. I truly believe spending that much time focused on what other people are doing will just wear you out.
Yes, without an ear to bend we’d explode or implode – some kind of ‘oding’. When I see something hinky going on, yes I will vent and then move on. It just makes me cherish whatever reviews, ranks I get. I am comforted that I didn’t do anything hinky to get them. I don’t have time to deal with all that author X is doing and all the other things in my life. I vent and I move on. Sometimes I might need to vent a wee bit longer.
You can vent away safely. The vent stops here. Well, not HERE. You know what I mean.
Extremely well done, Josh. Informative and amusing, and frankly, it was wonderful to see such an experienced hand as yourself speaking out on this. Thank you.
Thanks so much, Rachel!
Hold on! So you are saying…
We are not supposed to suck our toes?
You can still suck OTHER writers’ toes, TP. THAT will never change.
Chocolate sauce optional.
Dammit Teddypig! You stole my line!
Great post as always, Josh. I find it a little bit disconcerting that people need guidelines on how to behave like a grownup. I’ve seen some of what you’re talking about, and I’ve seen people get called out on it. It’s not pretty, and if I were on the being called out end of it, I think I’d end up living somewhere in Siberia, never to be heard of again.
You wouldn’t think so, Marilyn, but it is a confusing business. And it does take a while to get any traction. And there is so much competition…
Yes, I see exactly how and why it happens, but buying into the idea that you need to step on the bodies of your fellow writers to get ahead is not only wrong, it’s foolish.
Um, as someone who has just written her first chapter it sounds like a deep, deep sea out there- with a big bad kraken and not pretty mermen.
How do people have the energy for all this bad stuff and surely it would just bleed out into in their work.Ok that sounds naive even for me, but as a fan I am very aware that the writers I follow on twitter or whatever show daily the qualities I most enjoy in their work; wit, intelligence, kindness, and wicked fun. You can fake somethings but you can’t fake that.
A very thought provoking post. Thanks Josh.
Raine, that’s not as naive as you think.
I do honestly believe that if your focus is on someone else’s popularity (and it’s usually their popularity not even analysis of their writing), then it’s not on your own writing.
The people who believe this stuff works are the people who think their own writing is as good as anyone else’s and that success is all about promotion.
Promotion certainly factors in — especially for a first book — but ultimately the thing that keeps readers coming back book after book, year after year, has to be about the stories and the way you interact with your readers.
Great post Josh 🙂
I’m just like Lisa sc, Jessewave is practically the only site I visit to read reviews.
If I want to buy a book, I usually read the description. And that’s all. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn’t 🙂
Wave has done an incredible job of building this site into a premier m/m resource.
That said, Amazon reviews are very, very important. Meaning…not having ANY is far worse than having bad ones.
I don’t think the reviews themselves necessarily sway anyone — as you say, most people buy books based on the description of the book itself — but no amazon reviews seems to translate into an (unfair) announcement that you self-published and couldn’t even pay anyone to read your work.
Not sure why that is — maybe because Amazon is kind of a community as well as a bookselling venue. I know not having reviews on B&N or other sites is no big deal, but no reviews on Amazon is like the kiss of death.
So writers do tend to panic and try and fix that by whatever means possible. But it is only treating the symptom not the diesease.
Josh
I used to post reviews on Amazon and did so up until about 6 months ago when I realized what a cesspool it has become.
Authors stalking reviewers who write negative reviews of their books; reviewers who only ever publish 5 star reviews – I guess they never read a book they didn’t like; authors who ask me to post reviews of their books on Amazon but only the ones that are 5 stars; and on and on. So I stopped.
Sure Amazon is a community but have you ever posted a dissenting view there? I have and it’s not pleasant when everyone regards you as their enemy. So I stopped.
Reviewers whose sole aim is to be an Amazon Top Reviewer so they flood Amazon with reviews. How can they have a life and read so many books and write so many “reviews?” No one at Amazon seems to care or question them. So I stopped.
There is no quality control at Amazon about the reviews and many of them are either expanded blurbs and not really reviews, or the reviews contain spoilers, without warnings. So I stopped.
Authors who write reviews (or blurbs) for their friends. So I stopped.
I could give you many more reasons why I don’t have a high regard for Amazon reviews. However, since I’m not an author and have no vested interest in having a review of my book posted there, and don’t aspire to be an Amazon Top Reviewer, it doesn’t really matter.
I know that others have different views of Amazon reviews and there are positives, but too many negatives for me to want to continue being one of the reviewers on Amazon, unless things change. Look at what happened with Amos Larsen in his zeal to become an Amazon Top Reviewer. It sure blew up in his face.
The thing about Amazon reviews that makes them different from a site like your own, is that they’re supposed to be amateur or “citizen” reviews. Meaning, it’s *okay* that a reader gushes only about the books she likes or that some psycho gets up and rants about how he hates all gay books by women.
It’s okay because the criteria for these reviews is different — meaning all that’s required is that the “reviwer” has bought something from Amazon so that, though their names can be concealed, they aren’t truly anonymous.
This is both the strength and the weakness of the Amazon review system.
In it’s best sense it’s pure democracy and word-of-mouth. ANYONE can write a review. But that also means that there are a lot of truly stupid reviews on Amazon and the system lends itself to “anonymous” attacks even if Amazon knows who those reviewers are. It also means there are a lot of heartfelt and heartwarming Amazon reviews and some of my favorite reviews — back when I used to let myself read reviews — were on Amazon.
Because so many people buy books from Amazon and because Amazon is the number one commercial vehicle for indie and self-published books, having zero reviews of any kind just looks bad. You look like the new kid at school that no one will befriend.
Why? Because the only books that get zero reviews are obscure and really bad self-published titles or equally obscure academic texts. Most fiction titles (still in print) do get a few reviews.
No reviews at Amazon translates into a negative message in a more immediate and damaging way than no professional reviews does.
Amazon reviews are their own art and they have over time developed their own code. You can almost read between the lines between the reviews from family members and friends, reviews from jealous authors or readers who (on general principle) dislike anyone getting too much praise, and reviews from people who are very sincere and try very hard to write good reviews of the books they read.
I’m very grateful to that last bunch of reviewers. I want Amazon reviews. Do I want anyone posting anything less than five stars? No. Of course I don’t. Frankly, I won’t even glance at anything under four stars. It’ll simply irritate me, and I don’t need that. But I don’t try to get them removed either. They are what they are. It’s all part of the Amazon democracy in action. And they all help to drive sales. In fact, the occasional nutty low rating merely serves to validate the high ratings.
Is there abuse of the Amazon system? Well yes. As in any endeavor there are those who want to succeed at any price.
Now that you mention it, there are a couple of people who write excellent reviews on Amazon and I read them when I’m considering buying a book by an unknown writer. 🙂 However I’m suspicious when someone who has posted hundreds (or more) reviews on Amazon doesn’t have one that’s below 5 stars. How can that be? Are all of those books so great there is not one negative thing to say about them? For me, credibility is very important and something like that would lead to a red flag. However, that’s beside the point. As you say, most of the reviews are “amateur” reviews from friends, despite the few psychos.
I understand why as a writer, it would be important for you that your books are reviewed on Amazon, despite some of the crazy things they have been doing over the last couple of years. It would definitely beg the question why, if none of your books or for that matter any authors’ books were not reviewed on a site like Amazon.
I suppose I’m just cynical but I promise to be nice from now on. 🙂
As you say, most of the reviews are “amateur” reviews from friends, despite the few psychos.
Actually, the more reviews the more balanced the rating — and the less chance that friends and family are posting.
Now and again I will see a writer targeted for some reason–negative review after negative review, and it’s clearly personal and not about the work. But that stuff is easy to spot.
Yes, there are Amazon reviewers who are legendary for reading many many books and only giving one star reviews. But here’s the brutal reality of publishing. Many of those reviews were listed in mainstream releases as legitimate reviews — right there with the professional reviews.
Is it right or fair? No. Not if she’s not really reading (heck, maybe she does only finish the books she loves). But right or not, publishers took those reviews, valued them, and ran with them.
Yes, there are Amazon reviewers who are legendary for reading many many books and only giving one star reviews.
Sorry. I meant FIVE star reviews. Typing too fast.
I agree with you, Wave. I once wrote a review of a popular YA author on Amazon for a book I hoped to use in my classroom. After reading the book, I found it to be too adult for my students and said so in the review. Boy did I get slammed by the author’s fans. Since I had no dog in the fight, I really didn’t care and disengaged in the battle. They had their right to their opinion and I had mine.
But I do agree with the 5 star reviewers who have seemingly never met a m/m novel they didn’t like. I am always WTF? I mean you cannot like everything, can you? *g*
However despite all this, I still write reviews on Amazon, of books I love and books I think need some work, and if people don’t like my opinion, they are welcome to look at the other reviews of that particular book and decide for themselves. We all have different tastes. What I might love, you might loathe. So I wouldn’t take just my word when you buy a book.
But I do agree with the 5 star reviewers who have seemingly never met a m/m novel they didn’t like. I am always WTF? I mean you cannot like everything, can you? *g*
This is the Catch-22 of reviewing. Most people (I’m not talking about those who get caught up in becoming “reviewers”) only review when they love something or when they hate it.
They’re not looking for credibility as reviewers — that’s something that only troubles someone who begins to see themselves as apart from regular fans and readers, someone who begins to view herself as A Reviewer.
You and Wave have both said it right here. You won’t have credibility as a reviewer if you only review the stuff you love, but the thing about Amazon is that it does encourage the extremes of opinion becasue the average non-professional reader only bothers with the trouble of posting a review for a book he loves or hates. Or sometimes to communicate with the author.
(Loyal readers will support an author with reviews but they’re loyal readers so of course their opinion is positive! They wouldn’t be actively helping the author if they didn’t love the work.)
There have been all kinds of studies done on this. But reviewing itself–the nature of reviewing is changing, just as publishing is–because of the Internet and because of technology.
So now just as everyone can be a writer of fiction, everyone can be a reviewer of fiction.
It’s fascinating to observe as someone who started out before there WAS an internet.
Over the years I have learned to “read between the lines” of the Amazon reviews. I can spot in a minute the bogus one star, or even five star reviewer – why give one star just because there was “too much sex” when the book is listed/tagged EROTICA! This only makes the reviewer barely credible and doesn’t warrant my further attentions.
I do leave reviews on Amazon, but I have never left a one or two star. I just figure if I hate a book that much, I’ll move on. My five stars, and there HAVE been a few of them, are carefully documented reviews telling exactly why I would rate the book so high. I try to write reviews like the ones I would appreciate reading when deciding whether to purchase a book or not.
Thanks Josh for the M/M author’s What Not To Do travel guide – lot’s of good info for fledgling writer of this genre, and others! 🙂
Leah
Leah, the Amazon review that cracks me up is on MOM. The reviewer is disgusted because the whole focus of the book is about writing gay fiction.
Uh…first clue. The TITLE. 😀
Glad you found the post useful.
Great post, Josh! As a newbie and a young’un–at forty? I love you best, I surely do, LOL–I appreciate a voice of reason in what can be a nutty and sometimes not-so-fun business. Plus, anything that helps me corral my toe-sucking to a less obnoxious level is *bursting* with win. LOL 😉
Thanks, Kari. All I have to do is remember how confused I was when I first got on the net, how many appalling mistakes I made, and I know exactly where a lot of this comes from.
Another insightful and witty post, Josh. Thank you for taking the time to share your wisdom with all of us out here.
Like someone else commented, its really all common sense, and that grownups need to be reminded is well, I don’t know, sometimes boggling. I just hope my newbie mistakes aren’t horrific. I usually fear coming across like a total yahoo so much that I spend forever editing myself – and then I end up not commenting at all.
This comment only took 17 mins… 😉
Yes, LC, a lot of this — most of this, I would think — is common sense. Certainly we all know it’s wrong to stab someone else in the back.
Apparently there are some who confuse teamwork with being in the mob.
And they may even have some success with those tactics, but what they fail to get is that whatever success they have is minimal to what they could have had if they’d worked as hard at the writing as they did worrying about what other authors were doing.
Lucia, I’ve seen many new authors — in all innocence — write their own reviews (believing this is the way it’s done). And frankly the stupidity of the Goodreads system encourages it.
But authors have many, many tools for getting the word out about their work. Writing their own reviews is silly.
This is one of the few times where I’m almost proud to be a little naive, because I was under the impression that these things went without saying. I know better now.
Then again, as long as manufacturers need to warn consumers that drills are not meant for dental work (something that cracks me up every time), posts like these are necessary.
Great post, Josh. 🙂
This will hopefully keep me from making these mistakes when I’m finally ready to submit my writing.
Cayendi, the problem is that if your publishing stablemates are all telling you this is how it’s done, this is what the successful writers are doing, everyone does this…well, you might start to wonder if maybe it’s true.
Maybe there IS a secret publishing underground code of behavior…?
But no. Of course not. And you know how you know that for a fact? The kind of author who advises that behavior is an author mostly interacting with other authors. The most popular and bestselling authors are primarily interacting with READERS. Or they’re not interacting at all. They’re just writing all the time (KA Mitchell and JL Langley come to mind).
Cayendi, the problem is that if your publishing stablemates are all telling you this is how it’s done, this is what the successful writers are doing, everyone does this…well, you might start to wonder if maybe it’s true.
*nods*
Yes, that makes it pretty hard to realise it’s not the right way.
The most popular and bestselling authors are primarily interacting with READERS. Or they’re not interacting at all. They’re just writing all the time
Honestly, I’m still getting used to writers being accessible. It takes me a while to gather the courage to actually address them.
Though, when I was a teenager, I once was dead set on letting my favourite writer know how much I enjoyed his SF series. I can barely even remember how long it took me to find a contact address. Getting a letter back from him was such a thrill.
And K.A. Mitchell and J.L. Langley are definitely in my list of favourite authors
But, but, but… Golden Café Speckled Trout! How can you NOT want it? LOL!
I have to say that everything you said above works for anyone, not just the new authors. There is this author who has been around forever. It took me years to read her books because she was really nasty to several other authors and it just made me nauseous. Finally, I gave in, I’ve read the books, I can honestly say I adore her writing, but… I’m not going to exactly beat the drum for her, if you know what I mean. I still feel that bad, discourteous behavior should have some consequences. If other people felt the same way as I did – think of all the reviews, recommendations to friends, blog posts, sold books she missed just because she was, shell we say, less than gracious.
As someone who was on their mailing lists since I discovered their books, I can say the picture you painted about evil masterminds Robert Crais and Michael Connelly made me spill my coffee all over my keyboard. *snickers*
I’m hoping to see Robert Crais reviewed here someday. I’m thinking the series is moving toward that :-). Last year at a signing I asked him when Elvis and Joe were going to kiss. He laughed…
Last year at a signing I asked him when Elvis and Joe were going to kiss.
LOL! Oh, my… what a picture! The silent, broody type and the smartass. That IS an m/m plot in the making!
He said “OMG you’re out there writing Joe and Elvis slash fics aren’t you?” I told him that, alas, I am talentless, so I have to bribe my friends to write it for me. 🙂
Lololol, the power of slash fandoms. Even the bestselling mainstream authors fear them. XD
Let’s just say: after this, I’m going to read The Sentry with completely different mind-set. ~_^
Maybe I should review The Sentry. lol.
He did agree with me that it is a romance series of a sort. He’s a very nice man. I think I only scared him a little bit. LOL
😀 I love it.
Hey, I absolutely want every Golden Cafe Speckled Trout award I can get! But I’m not going to harangue everyone on the web to get them to vote, and I sure as hell am not going to set up a dozen hotmail accounts to vote anonymously. I’m lucky if I remember to vote under my own name.
Promotion is a two-edged sword. There are a number of writers who I just…despise and won’t read for love or money. Why? Their online antics are such a turn-off. And a lot of those antics are boorish, snobby, rude, or just flat out unkind.
Sometimes being very visible is a negative.
Crais and Connelly. 😀 Or the idea of Parker hunched over his desk, sweating over someone else’s Amazon numbers.
Good stuff, Josh. Find I don’t have time to engage in all the hype apparently required of writers in this genre. About all I manage to do is request reviews from respected sites. And those sites have been kind.
Interestingly, I wrote a review of a book written by an “adored” writer, that was not wholly positive. His response was to provide a review of my work that was, yes, not wholly positive. I absolutely detest this quid pro quo amongst authors whose egos may, just may be a little too fragile for prime time. Suffice it to say–cross my heart and hope to die–I will take bad reviews gently into that good night, not raging, not angry, not urged to senseless reciprocity.
BTW I’m still holding steady at below 200 FB friends. I think I’m comfortable with that. Can’t manage the attention it takes to keep up with them all as it is!
George, what you experienced was childish and silly (assuming the author wasn’t being honest in his feelings about your book) but this is why authors should not review each other. Especially because we are the most critical judges out there. Or maybe it’s just me, but rarely would I be handing out anything higher than two stars if I were totally, bluntly honest.
But I’m judging every book by mainstream standards. As in, barring subject matter, is this both skilled and original enough to be purchased by Simon and Schuster? Most of the time my answer is no.
So I only do a little reviewing here and I judge every book on an m/m curve. Meaning, considering the experience and editing most writers get in this genre…here’s my grade.
And if I think a book really sucks, I keep it to myself because unless I’m going to dissect the work as a writing exercise for one of my lists, how does my blistering opinion on an already published work help that poor fellow author?
As for engaging in hype…yes, promotion is absolutely necessary in this and all writing genres today. Period. You can make it as painless or as difficult as you like, though. It doesn’t have to be you standing outside the circus tent with a bullhorn. 😀
Thanks Josh! Your knowledge and willingness to share are very much appreciated. I’ve been calling myself an author for three years now and I still have lots to learn about the promoting side of things, I find it the hardest part of the business. I don’t think I’ll ever understand the tricks some people seem to find acceptable.
Stevie, promotion is the hardest part of the gig — most of us don’t enjoy it, as George points out above.
Oh, we enjoy interacting with readers, no question, but being accessible means balancing the demands of deadlines with promotion — and that’s not easy.
Also, to do what we do, we writers need a lot of quiet, solo time. That’s just a fact, so again the need to remain accessible has to be balanced by the need to have time to collect our thoughts, to let creativity take root and flourish.
It requires balance and when you’re starting out and trying to make a name for yourself, finding that balance is tricky.
I’m not starting out and I find it tricky. Facebook, Twitter, Goodreads, blogging…when I’m in the midst of deadlines I just can’t do it all. Something somewhere has to give, and I’m sagging all over the place right now.
But treating others as you wish to be treated is a simple, easy rule to follow.
people really do that sort of stuff?
That was my first thought as well, Lissa. Planting your own reviews, punking other authors… sure sounds like an awful waste of writing time to me.
There’s only one way to get to the top in any field – do the best damn work you’re capable of. Keep your head down, keep writing, keep the books coming.
The social media stuff is all very well and good, but frankly, I think a lot of it is just plain bull. There’s no substitute for hard work. Keep writing, and the rest will follow.
There’s only one way to get to the top in any field – do the best damn work you’re capable of. Keep your head down, keep writing, keep the books coming.
Mega-promotion will work for a first book, but if the book doesn’t live up to the promotion, end of story. Literally.
Most of this nonsense is done in an effort to manipulate word-of-mouth. Word-of-mouth can only be faked so far and then the word shrivels up and blows away because readers basically like what they like. Which is why the description of books in reviews ise more influential than the opinion of the reviewer (in most cases). So five authors raving to each other about another fabulous author in their publishing house looks great from a distance, but you can only use that trick once. If a readers buys the book and is left feeling…meh…than the five authors blurbing up the next book falls on deaf ears.
You need readers to buy ALL your books, not just the first one. Each book sells the next, which is why each book has to be the best it can be.
Yep. They really do. But not most people. It’s only a very small minority of people who act this way.
It’s worth posting about because these practices are suddenly popping up again, which leads me to believe the mistaken idea is circulating that this is normal, professional behavior.
Very well written and thought out.
I’ve noticed those authors who are so aggressively going after readers to buy their books. Before I got into this whole social networking thing I didn’t know about all you mentioned above. Once I say how some author acted. I detested it. The constant invites to “like” or buy their books. In reality if I want to buy or “like” you I would seek you out on my own. In my opinion if an author does act this way it turns me off and even if I love their work it would make me thing twice long and hard about buying their books. Seeing all this behavior and all this they do I wonder how they find time to actually write.
As a newbie to this genre I’ve been using examples of authors I like and seek out to know better. And they are friendly, offer sage advice and engage with readers. Josh you’re one of those authors that I respect and admire. No not in a stalkerish way. LOL. More of a wow he is a genuinely nice human being and I want to be like him when I grow up. (grin) Love the Adrien English series.
Besides you, the other authors that are my fav’s so far hasn’t engaged in this behavior. Thinking about it now… the authors I seek out are a lot like how I enjoy interacting with people in general. Hmm… maybe that’s why I connect so much to the author and their writing. They are real people and see me as such. Now you’ve got me thinking about it. LOL. That is a good thing. Very thought provoking post.
That’s the key, Talia. Interacting with readers — and genuinely interacting with them, not hardselling them a product.
I think maybe it’s easy to forget that behind all these email addresses are actual people. And, in fact, I think that’s where some of the bad behavior comes from. Again using the analogy of how some people act when they get behind the wheel. As though everyone else on the road is a car and not a person.
It’s so much easier to be rude to an email address as opposed to a person with feelings. I try hard to remember that behind the cyber anonymity, we’re all people with our fears and worries and health problems and private griefs.
I realized last night I’d forgotten to respond to a comment from Kate Rothwell on a list, and I felt bad — and then I worried that she might think I was snubbing her because people do sometimes take the simple inability to keep up as a snub where none is intended.
Anyway, I lost my point. ;-D
This is so timely, especially with it being “Vote for me” season right now.
I’ve actually been struggling with how to talk to a friend who has written a self-help book. She’s gone from sane woman to frenzied self-promoter overnight. How do you tell an old friend that you’ve blocked her FB posts? LOL! So its not only happening in the romance and m/m world.
Thanks Josh!
I think there’s a tendency for everyone to go a little crazy with that first book. It’s just so exciting to finally, finally have a book out.
And it’s hard to accept that everyone isn’t equally as thrilled or interested in your progress every step of the way.
It’s probably worse in m/m because the numbers of authors and aspiring authors to readership is really out of proportion. It’s changing everywhere, of course, and that’s due to technology. Now anyone who whimsically thinks I ought to write a book can actually do it. And even put it up for sale.
No experience necessary.
Hee hee, I got a few snickers out of your post. Oh my, is it hard to get ahead in this field or what?
Once I saw a rather successful m/m writer respond to negative reviews of his works with answers like, “I’ve been compared to who and who, won this and that award”… I just went, “oh no.” Cos that’s just so distasteful.
I wasn’t aware how malicious people can be, especially between fellow writers, until I got involved in a fan fiction forum. The drama, the backstabbing, the bullying and the cuddling, they are all a bit pathetic.
I think it’s the weirdness between fellow writers that is especially painful because if anyone ought to understand how tough this business is, it’s another writer.
But of course other writers are also the folks most prone to jealousy and panic and frustration.
We all want our share of the cake. We want to be loved. That’s kind of what it boils down to right? We want the best publishers and the best reviews and lots of people to read us and tell us they love our stories, I mean, most of us would continue to write in our lonely little lairs without any of that, but we wouldn’t write so prolifically or try so hard to complete every project if we weren’t planning to share.
And nobody shares in the hope of being ignored or criticized or backstabbed.
I’ve found myself rapidly losing patience with the constant flood of Facebook notifications alerting me that Author X is requesting that I “like” Author X and/or Author X’s book. Sometimes when I think I’m being too passive about my self-promotion I remind myself of that.
Another tempting but inadvisable behavior is engaging with people who criticize you, especially if you feel the criticism is unfair, and extra-especially in a public forum. I’ve talked with other authors about the (sometimes nearly insurmountable) temptation to respond to negative reviews, or negative fan letters, etc. To this I apply what I call the WarGames rule, which I developed over fifteen years in fandoms – it’s like tic tac toe. The only way to win is not to play. Do Not Engage. There is quite literally nothing you can say that will not come off as defensive arrogant, even if you think you’re being super diplomatic and polite. The mere fact of your response will put your critic on the defensive, and that is not where you want them to be.
I’ve resisted the temptation to go looking for discussions of my stuff by reminding myself that readers deserve a safe place to bash me if they so choose, without wondering if I’m looking over their shoulders. I find that I function a lot better if I keep my writerly nose out of readerly spaces.
I admit to engaging in one piece of questionable author behavior. I did mention my own book on an Amazon forum asking for recommendations for gay-themed action thrillers. I recommended several other books…and then mine, too. Mea culpa.
I’ve found myself rapidly losing patience with the constant flood of Facebook notifications alerting me that Author X is requesting that I “like” Author X and/or Author X’s book. Sometimes when I think I’m being too passive about my self-promotion I remind myself of that.
For sure. There’s a real balance and I personally think it’s better to err on the side of caution. You, for example, haven’t done a ton of promotion, but readers are still talking about your first book, still hoping for a sequel. The work speaks for itself.
Another tempting but inadvisable behavior is engaging with people who criticize you, especially if you feel the criticism is unfair, and extra-especially in a public forum.
😀 Tell me about it.
I’ve talked with other authors about the (sometimes nearly insurmountable) temptation to respond to negative reviews, or negative fan letters, etc.
Negative fan letters is a weird one. That’s someone definitely hoping to engage with you. Very often the negative fan doesn’t have a clue how their negativity is coming across.
To this I apply what I call the WarGames rule, which I developed over fifteen years in fandoms – it’s like tic tac toe. The only way to win is not to play. Do Not Engage. There is quite literally nothing you can say that will not come off as defensive arrogant, even if you think you’re being super diplomatic and polite. The mere fact of your response will put your critic on the defensive, and that is not where you want them to be.
I would take it one step further and avoid acknowledging reviews at all. I’ve developed this approach very slowly and with some reluctance because I’ve made some wonderful friendships through reviews people have written of my work — many of my first friendships (and the most lasting)on the net came through reviews. Wave is one of those friendships, as a matter of fact. But I’ve also terminated friendships over reviews and the biggest and ugliest battle I’ve had on the net was over a review (even though the actual reviewer and I were friends by that point). I just won’t read reviews any more, and if I do read, I won’t acknowledge. It’s not meant to be dismissive of the reviewer, it’s simply that I feel authors need to preserve a certain professional distance with reviewers. It’s better for the author and its better for the reviewer.
I’ve resisted the temptation to go looking for discussions of my stuff by reminding myself that readers deserve a safe place to bash me if they so choose, without wondering if I’m looking over their shoulders. I find that I function a lot better if I keep my writerly nose out of readerly spaces.
Yep. I’m in 100% agreement.
I admit to engaging in one piece of questionable author behavior. I did mention my own book on an Amazon forum asking for recommendations for gay-themed action thrillers. I recommended several other books…and then mine, too. Mea culpa.
Baby stuff. I’d say a huge percentage of first time authors engage in that one. I probably did it myself, although back then we were scribbing with rocks on the wall of our caves.
I never dreamed just over a year ago, when I first made the foray into reading M/M, that not only would I discover a plethora of great writing, but also an education in the industry. 🙂 Reading posts by authors both here and in other forums has been a real eye opener. Yes, the internet has opened up great opportunities, but unfortunately also provides an open avenue for abuse. Marketing is necessary in any business, however there is no substitute for hard work, genuineness, and good old word of mouth from satisfied consumers. In fact, word of mouth is what led me to purchase the first particular M/M books that I did.(which included one by Josh ;-)) For what it’s worth – my experience with the M/M authors/publishers/artists I have corresponded with has been nothing but outstanding.
“You need readers to buy ALL your books, not just the first one. Each book sells the next, which is why each book has to be the best it can be.”
As a reader I agree whole heartedly. If I love the first book I read by an author you can bet I’ll be setting my sights on their whole catalog.
I think Josh is officially the gateway drug for m/m fiction. 🙂 He was one of the first authors I read when I started reading published m/m, too.
I think Josh is officially the gateway drug for m/m fiction. He was one of the first authors I read when I started reading published m/m, too.
HA. Jane’s Addiction. 🙂
It was all the publicity Jane’s book (Zero at the Bone) got in the Dear Author Sweet Sixteen last spring that got me to read my first m/m. Big hugs for both of you for that! 🙂
As usual, I am looking in from the outside. Every so often I hear a little bit about stuff like this, but I guess most of it just flies over my head or I’m not linked in to the right forums, groups, facebooks, twitters, blogs, sites, etc. When I read your post, Josh, I found it interesting but at the same time I was thinking, “Good Lord, do a lot of people really do this? Are they still in third grade?” And I feel pretty good about hovering on the outskirts of the fishbowl.
I try to be careful with whatever I put out to the interwebz, because I frequently put my virtual foot in my virtual mouth (no reference to toe sucking intended), coming across as mean or heartless when that was not my intent.
I want to stress again that if a lot of people were doing this stuff, it would be the norm and I wouldn’t need to post on it — we’d all just run our publishing careers like the House of Medici.
Instead of worrying about bad reviews we could worry about poisoned bottles of wine. ;-D
I am not alone in loathing aggressive advertising and have so far avoided the ‘suggestions’ and groups that seem to crop up everyday. Mainly down to you, Josh, posting about it within two weeks of joining FB.
Reviews are a double-edged sword. On one point, we newbies are desperate for them, and on the other we die of mortification for every bad one.
I love my genre, and would like to be known for good manners within it, even if I do ask too many questions.
I don’t think you *can* ask too many questions, Sue. I mean, that’s how we all get the answers we need. Nobody is born knowing this stuff.
You find bad apples in every barrel, but I think small press and indie publishers are already fighting a certain amount of prejudice. Half of mainstream thinks ebooks are the same as POD and that they both automatically mean self-published.
I think we have to conduct ourselves with an extra eye to professionalism if we ever want to get past the idea that we’re a bunch of fringe element amateurs.
I can only speak from the reader side of things, but you’ve inspired me to post reviews on Amazon more often. Even though I read hundreds of books each year, I’ve only posted 17 reviews there. I don’t usually do mid-range reviews. I post either when I’ve been really moved by a book or am so pissed off at how bad it was. I really hate to do negative reviews. I’ve only done 6 over about 14 years buying at Amazon. I don’t like to knock people who try to write (I don’t do it after all), but some books should never have been published & I feel duped into buying them – especially if they had rave reviews which were probably fake.
Some things do make me hesitate to review: I tend not to bother to review people I feel are already successful (already have many reviews, etc) and I am also somewhat concerned by backlash from a negative review – although I haven’t experienced that first hand so far. Also, the star system is weird. Some people – and I’ve noticed this a lot on Goodreads – will rate a book three stars & then give what sounds like a rave review. Huh?
BTW, I also write the occasional email or blog comment directly to an author, but I realize that doesn’t do as much good for promotion.
It might not do much for promo, but it sure does do great things for the soul 🙂
Amen.
I really hate to do negative reviews. I’ve only done 6 over about 14 years buying at Amazon. I don’t like to knock people who try to write (I don’t do it after all), but some books should never have been published & I feel duped into buying them – especially if they had rave reviews which were probably fake.
After a while I think you get a feel for the tone of those reviews? I can almost always pick them out, whether they’re for another author or myself. Of course one obvious clue is the hostile reviewer who has only reviewed your work — or maybe a couple of oddball items like a coffepot they loved, a planter they loved, and your book which they hated more than anything on earth. ;-D
Same thing with the adoring reviewer who only posts reviews of one book or one author. Now we authors can’t bitch about that one because we often beg our readership to please go out and write us a few amazon or B&N reviews. It’s enough to ask without also insisting they write enough reviews of other writers so that their opinion carries additional weight!
Some things do make me hesitate to review: I tend not to bother to review people I feel are already successful (already have many reviews, etc)
I feel the pain of those writers because I’ve had books — quite good books, I think — where some loony came along and bashed them, thus screwing my rating up. And I do mean loony. You know the kind of “review” where it’s totally off the point of the book. Why-isn’t-there-more-description-of-the-workings-of-piston-engines-in-this-so-called-romance! Huh??? Author’s eyes begin to spin.
and I am also somewhat concerned by backlash from a negative review – although I haven’t experienced that first hand so far.
I hear about that. I’ve never known it to happen to anyone I actually knew, but I could see it.
Also, the star system is weird. Some people – and I’ve noticed this a lot on Goodreads – will rate a book three stars & then give what sounds like a rave review. Huh?
I know. So bewildering.
BTW, I also write the occasional email or blog comment directly to an author, but I realize that doesn’t do as much good for promotion.
Oh! But this is what makes that kind of feedback so important to writers. It’s the thing that keeps us writing when we feel like what’s the flipping point? A reviewer cannot help but write with an audience in mind–just like any writer–but the only audience a reader has in a comment or email to an author is the author. So it’s pure, undistilled heartfelt pleasure in the work and it is one of the most touching and encouraging things that happens to a writer.
Plus it takes guts to write personally to a total stranger. What if the writer ignores you? What if the writer takes offense?
I can’t over-emphasize how much these letters and comments from readers mean. No, they don’t help us promote, and we don’t care. They mean a lot more to us than promotion.
Those letters symbolize why we choose to publish our work. Not why we write, but why we make the decision to publish.
This was interesting, and extremely disconcerting. It saddens me that so many people seem to think the only way to ‘get ahead’ or look good is by tearing someone else down. Not only is it bad karma but whatever ‘advantages’ one gains by behaving badly are short term, short lived and ultimately Pyrrhic at best. I haven’t been kicking around in this pool long, but I’ve made some very excellent friends of the fellow writers I’ve encountered and it wouldn’t occur to me to be anything but happy for them when they enjoy a personal success. There is room enough for everyone and ultimately no matter how one behaves it is the reader who decides what they like. I try to learn from everyone I meet/socially interface with, and read, my goal being to be the best me as a writer I can be. No one else can write my stories. Or has my voice. For whatever that is worth. Tee hee. Will my works find a home and an audience? Only time will tell. But for sure I’ll get there or not by my own honest efforts not by beating anyone else down on the way up!
There is room enough for everyone and ultimately no matter how one behaves it is the reader who decides what they like.
Bingo. There’s plenty of cake for everyone. You don’t need to take cuts. We’ll bake more.
There’s at least one author who I am only aware of because of his/her vitriolic reviews of fellow writers’ books. How to shoot yourself in the foot: a potential reader lost.
And multiply that how many times?
It’s not that I don’t understand the pleasure of reviewing and the temptation to point out where U R Doin’ it Rong. Reading and analyzing other writers is one way we learn and improve our own craft.
But how can you be so sure, when it comes to something as subjective as art, that your opinion is the right one and the only one? So sure that you would be vitrolic about it?
*I* wouldn’t be vitrolic, and as well all know, I am the expert on EVERYTHING. ;-D
Thanks for another interesting article! Though I have to say I feel bad for authors who want to write a negative review because they honestly didn’t like the book. Would people automatically jump on them and accuse them of xy and z mentioned above? How would an author avoid that?
I suppose if you only review one of their books and give a thorough review then it may be seen as that and not being mean…I just don’t think authors should feel required to write complimentary reviews and just not write a review for books they didn’t enjoy.
I know this is a bit off topic, but it seems to be a complication (though maybe you can enlighten me).
It’s not that you can’t review, Alex. There are lots and lots of books you can review as harshly as you like and no one will mind. They’ll either find your opinions of interest or not.
Reviewing your peers? I’m curious about the impulse that would make you wish to negatively review someone you might meet face to face one of these days?
Maybe if you’ve already got a significant following for your reviews? I’ve seen writers fall into this as they try to make the transition from well-known reviewer to bestselling author. OR maybe if you have a particular reviewing mission?
I know Erastes and her circle of writer friends do most of the reviewing of historical fiction in this genre. Of course that means that a fair bit of reviewing of friends goes on. I don’t know how they all handle that. Maybe there are some injured feelings, maybe not. But they’re on a mission to promote historical fiction, so it seems slightly different. They’re working to expand that particular sub-genre and I think they earnestly want the books in their genre to be more than the dubious stuff that sometimes passes for historical romance.
See, an author who feels compelled to comment negatively on a peer’s book is a puzzle to me. I wrote a book on writing m/m fiction and I rarely allow myself to review and I actually think my reviews would be pretty useful for new writers. But then the job of the reviewer is not to teach writing. And so I opened an evaluation service instead.
That said, I don’t think most authors will retailiate if you write a negative review. Few writers have time or energy to write you a retort review — assuming they even see your review. If they do see the review, they’ll think various uncomplimentary things about you and they might not rush to offer advice and help should you need it, but I doubt they’ll stalk you. No, it would be more in the vein of…Judi Charming regularly offers popular guest blog spots to other authors, and you need to get the word out on your new book, but unfortunately you just blasted *her* book.
It’s hard to hold your tongue when there are so many books that seem an affront to God and literature, but strategically it’s better not to indulge the longing to vent in public.
Just my opinion.
So what’s the protocol for an author reviewing another author’s work? As you know Josh, this site has a few guest reviewers who are authors. Their reviews are just as professional as those by the other guest reviewers who are not authors, but readers. If they write negative reviews, most of the time I agree with their opinion because I’ve read the book(s), so it would appear that they are reviewing simply because they enjoy doing so. It certainly does not appear to me that one of their reasons for reviewing is to spite other authors who may be more successful.
When Erastes reveiwed for this site she did most of the historical reviews, which made sense since she’s an expert of the genre.
You never know when you open a book if you’re going to like it, and I trust the guest reviewers to be as unbiased and professional as it’s humanly possible to be, within the context of giving a personal opinion.
If an author chooses to review other authors, I’d suggest they be as professional and objective as possible. And err on the side of generosity. I think all your reviewers attempt to be fair and objective and conscientious, Wave.
The fact that I personally don’t think writing negative reviews of one’s peers is a wise move, doesn’t mean everyone has to agree or we can’t be friends anymore. 😀
I give a lot of advice on writing and promoting and publishing, and I don’t doubt that many writers disagree with many things I say.
I think a writer who reviews must sooner or later decide which is more important: the reviewing or the writing.
Now that’s not necessarily the case in every realm of publishing, but as I think we’ve already established, this is a young, brash genre with some growing up to do.
This was a recent topic of discussion on Facebook. My personal suggestion would be to only offer a star rating for a friend’s book, but not to write a full review on Goodreads, for example, unless it was honestly a wholly positive review. I think it’s bad form to criticize a peer in public, unless you are an expert (Erastes can do it because she has the credentials and the writing style to carry it off). I’d prefer to keep any constructive criticism to a private note to an author I know well if I felt something deserved notice or really affected my enjoyment of the book.
I think it’s bad form to criticize a peer in public, unless you are an expert
Right. Bad form.
Here’s the difficulty–I’m thinking of George’s situation, but I’m guessing we can all relate.
Author A thinks she knows as much about writing as me and she writes me a mildly critical but mostly positive review.
Harmless, right? She reviews everybody.
The problem is, I’ve read Author A’s book and I found it overwrought, melodramatic, and essentially tedious. But I held my tongue because…bad form to criticize a fellow author, even when you’re an expert like (cough) me.
So now I see Author A’s review and, yes, I cannot help but think HOW VERY DARE SHE? I write freaking RINGS around her!
Etc. Etc.
And in the heat of the moment, I offer my unvarnished and undiplomatic opinion at Amazon. Or maybe I merely content myself with dinging her a couple of stars on Goodreads. Or I write a guest review for Wave.
Assuming Author A even sees my review, she’s liable to think–as George did in his situation–that my review was retalitory while in fact I really do think Author A is severely overrated. I just would have previously kept my opinion to myself.
The problem with writers is we ALL think we know what we’re doing and that we do what we do pretty damned well and who are *you,* fellow-less-popular-only-a-fraction-of-my-time-in-the-business-can’t-touch-my-sales-colleague to dare judge me in a public forum?
And if you think this is nutty stuff, try academia. ;-D
Maybe it’s different because I’m not (yet) an author, but I do enjoy reviewing (even if I’m shouting to the wind). I view reviewing as feedback, whether I’m getting it or giving it, and I would never write a review that I wouldn’t be willing to tell to that person’s face.
But I also see reviews as a good way for people who like similar books to find other good books. And if I enjoy an author enough to follow their reviews (I’m thinking GoodReads here), then I’d like to read their honest opinion. I can see how on Amazon this maybe wouldn’t work the same.
I’m curious about the impulse that would make you wish to negatively review someone you might meet face to face one of these days?
I don’t know if it’s an impulse to negatively review, just a desire to be honest, and as Wave said, you don’t always know what you’ll get at the end. I can understand the hesitation in wanting to not negatively review something by someone you may one day meet, but I feel it’s honest to review each book as you see it. If I’d ever have something published, I’d like my peers to give me honest feedback, even if it makes me wince (or weep). But, as you said, it’s just an opinion.
Alex
If I can give you a bit of advice about reviewing, whenever you write a negative review always try to find something positive to say about the book, and always state explicitly the areas where you found the book wanting. As you probably noticed, our reviews are quite long and there’s a reason for that. We try to be clear about the pros and cons of why a book didn’t appeal.
I did a post about 18 months about negative book reviews and why we do them, and I am enclosing a link. This post also contains a link to a post Josh did sometime prior about how an author should react (or not) to negative book reviews
http://www.gayromance.org/?p=798
There is a more recent one and if I can find it I’ll add that link later.
I found the other post (I have this great filing system lol) and here’s the link
http://www.gayromance.org/?p=35343
Happy reviewing. 🙂
This is all very good advice, and I certainly wouldn’t recommend or participate in the practices that you bring up. However. However, if you take a look at mainstream, “bestseller” writing today, you have to ask yourself, how are these people getting contracts? It’s not the writing.
I’ve been writing and publishing for a little over ten years now. Over and over, I’ve seen the same thing. The writers who can sell their writing by either working the system, or having an inside track, will get published and get the big contracts.
Writing is a business. It used to be that the only art involved was when the writer sat down to write. About ninety five percent of the time, that is no longer true. If you look at certain big name writers today, you see that, not only do they farm out their name to be plastered over the covers of books they didn’t write, the books themselves are so badly written, they’re laughable.
Publishing is evolving into a Madison Avenue hype-the-product business where the focus is on which writer’s story can be packaged and sold with the highest market penetration. The writing itself is slowly but surely taking a very sad, very unimportant second, sometimes third place in the publishing process.
I’m not sure what will happen to the industry, but I can definitely say that the quality of one’s writing matters less and less. The tipping point has almost swung in favor of write fast and sloppy, then sell hard and big.
I’m hoping that with e-publishing, and the affordability of e-readers, the talent that’s out there will be heard.
Actually, it is largely the writing. I know this won’t be a popular opinion, and I’m not saying that NY publishing doesn’t publish some crap books, but those books are flawed in different ways than most of the books are flawed here.
And I can get into this at another time — and I probably will touch on it in next month’s post which, per Wave’s request, will be on editing. Or what passes for editing here in mlandia.
The other thing that determines publication in mainstream — leaving out for the moment literary and established small presses — is how commercial a book is. Mainstream has to have a guarantee of a certain amount of sales to justify their print runs. Few m/m publishers are doing print runs. (Nor do they need to.)
So the books have to meet certain standards of writing which, typos and dumb-books-we-personally-don’t-like aside, they largely do, and they have to be commercial enough to appeal to thousands of people.
So while I do agree with you that mainstream publishing suffers from the same corporatization idiocy as much of the rest of the country, they are still publishing the kind of thing most readers want to read.
Josh, “corporatization idiocy”. . . loved that.
Thanks for your response.
So while I do agree with you that mainstream publishing suffers from the same corporatization idiocy as much of the rest of the country, they are still publishing the kind of thing most readers want to read.
(Sorry, jumping in.) I do agree with Ryssa that mainstream publishing is suffering from heavy commercialism in books, but the writing is not exactly the same as the ones in the m/m genre. I find myself having to divorce the m/m genre completely from mainstream publishing because of the difference in quality.
Sure, most mainstream books can get boring, but when I buy one, I know for a fact that the book would be cohesively written – solid beginning, plot, conflict, resolution, character development, etc, etc. Everything would be taken into consideration before it’s published – as a reader, I’m only bogged down with 1) do I like the particular writing style of the author, 2) does the story appeal to me, or 3) do the characters grow in the direction I’d like to see. These points are more subjective than objective – as a reader, I know the mainstream published book would be a polished piece of work – I would not have to worry about shifting POV, abrupt tense changes, incomprehensible passages, so on so forth.
I do not have that luxury with the m/m genre, much as it pains me to say. I love this niche, but it’s extremely rare to find books I don’t want to delete because heck, I just paid 7 bucks for it based on the blurb.
All this leads to one thing – I crave reviews – goodreads, amazon, m/m blogs like this one, etc. Reviewers give me a sense of what I want to read in a book, and since I always look at what types of books the reviewer rates, I can deduce whether or not his/her tastes mesh with mine. I still maintain that reviewers are not for the authors but for the readers.
This leads me to another point – I might love an author’s public persona, but I really…that’s not the reason I choose to read an author’s work. You (general you) can be the nicest person, but ultimately it comes down to the books you’re writing. Honestly, I may be a dinosaur, but I don’t really give a fig how anyone interacts with fans as long as you’re not being a raging douchebag. I’m here to read and enjoy books, so it’s weird that I see all the networking that goes on with Facebook and Twitter and whatever else.
Rambling aside, interesting post. I had no idea all this is happening in the m/m world.
I’m in agreement with you on all of that.
And again, reading a well-written review is a genuine pleasure. When I’m looking for info on an author or a book, I read the reviews on this site and I check out the interviews, etc.
I use Amazon as a research site quite frequently as well. When I go there to buy a book I’m irritated if there are only a couple of reviews and I can’t figure out if the book is my kind of thing or not. The more reviews, the better. I agree. I don’t even mind spoilers if I’m afraid a beloved character is killed or something like that!
Josh,
Loved your post, humorous and informative.
Amazon should limit reviews to items bought on Amazon. Think that would cut down on some of the nonsense?
I don’t know, to be honest. To some extent you have to take people on trust.
I have a lot of readers for whom Amazon is just one site they patronize. But it’s the main site for citizen reviews, so I do want them to be able to post even if they didn’t necessarily buy the book there.
You know most Amazon reviewers are sincere. We’re not talking about the majority of people, we’re talking about a few naughty authors. And when it comes to writing reviews of their own work, they probably would just go ahead and buy a copy on Amazon.
I’ve read all the comments and I’m more happy than ever that this is the review site I go to when I need to check out a book. Everyone is so civil in their comments. And that’s just the point I want to make. If newly published authors are only familiar with the ways of Amazon, then they probably do think that’s how you promote yourself. Unfortunately, all media is rife with negative behavior and we’re growing up surrounded by messages that that’s business as usual.
It seems to me that if an author tries to elevate her own status and books by knocking others down and attempting to keep them down, that author never raises the quality of his writing. The bar stays very, very low. It’s hard work to focus negative energy for any length of time and such a waste of time.
It seems to me that if an author tries to elevate her own status and books by knocking others down and attempting to keep them down, that author never raises the quality of his writing. The bar stays very, very low. It’s hard work to focus negative energy for any length of time and such a waste of time.
So very true, Patty.
I think the recipe for success — and sanity — is to focus on your own writing and not worry about how popular everyone else is. Because the odds are good whoever you’re worried about is just as uneasy and anxious and worried that her career isn’t progressing as fast as it should.
I’ve spent ages reading your post, Josh, and trying to read all the comments, too. I’ve enjoyed seeing everyone’s opinions.
Don’t have anything to add, other than it’s been a real eye-opener. I had no idea that this sort of thing’s been going on. We live and learn!
This just got to be an enormous discussion, didn’t it? 😀
Thank God I don’t post here more than once a month.
So that proposal I was going to discuss with you about two appearances a month isn’t going to fly? What a bummer. What are you going to do with the extra time – suck toes with TP? 🙂
WHAT? You’ve withdrawn your own toes from the offer!?
But I also see reviews as a good way for people who like similar books to find other good books. And if I enjoy an author enough to follow their reviews (I’m thinking GoodReads here), then I’d like to read their honest opinion. I can see how on Amazon this maybe wouldn’t work the same.
I should probably reiterate here that I love reviews and I often read them — just not of my own work. Not that I don’t love hearing my work praised. I’m human. Of course I love it! Too much, as a matter of fact.
I don’t know if it’s an impulse to negatively review, just a desire to be honest, and as Wave said, you don’t always know what you’ll get at the end.
Yes to all that. Listen, I’m not trying to discourage aspiring authors who love to review from reviewing. What I’m really saying is…a lot of authors use writing reviews as a promotional tool. They don’t write reviews simply because they love analyzing and discussing books, they also hope to build their name recognition and even a potential readership through writing reviews.
And it can work that way.
But it’s also possible it can work the other way. We’ve heard from readers today and other authors who’ve discussed negative experiences and feelings about reviewers.
So if you’re reviewing because you love ot review, go for it. But if you’re reviewing because you’re hoping it’s going to a great way to get your name out there, well maybe yes, maybe no.
And remember today’s topic was dirty tricks, not authors sincerely and conscientiously reviewing each other. The topic is authors grading other authors down as part of a strategy for success, or authors retaliating at what they believed was an unfair grading down.
When we talk about the wisdom of writing reviews as a promotional tool, we’re really getting into a different area.
So if you’re reviewing because you love to review, go for it.
Thank you for taking your (valuable) time to word haggle with me. I think we are essentially in agreement. (Though I’m still left disheartened that people feel the need to pull dirty tricks. To me that seems to ruin the point of being published. But I guess everyone goes in for a different reason.)
I’ve probably needlessly terrified scores of new writers. I just want to restate for the record that these behaviors are the exception to the rule not the rule.
I think they stem from unrealistic expectations. But that’s another post.
Yes, I think we’re basically in agreement!
Thank you, Josh.
Thanks for reading, Finn.
Great post Josh. I will say most of the books I have now I got them because of word of mouth more than anything. And, if I really like a book I also tell my friends. And, if I don’t like a book…guess what? Word of mouth. I really don’t pay much attention to reviews. If a book is written really well and holds my interest that’s what I’m looking for. Not “how many stars” this book got and what not. I have only ever contacted a few authors to let them know how much I loved their books. All of them except one wrote me back. I don’t expect authors to sit around checking their inbox for fan mail. However, I would like it if you tell people if they like your work to contact them, I would hope they would make the effort to write back. Usually, the only time I write to authors is to let them know how much I love their work, ask about upcoming releases, etc. So, I can honestly say Josh, authors like you are very much appreciated. Keep up the great writing! (By the way….love your books!)
Thank you very much, Amanda. It gives me pleasure to hear you’re enjoying the stories. I think most authors in this business appreciate their readers and make every effort to respond.
The number one selling tool a writer has — the make or break point — is the writing itself.
Everything we do comes down to that — the moment the reader opens the book and begins to read. At that point everything else becomes moot.
Loved your column, Josh. I feel pretty naive not realizing all the machinations out there. Whoa!
I’m definite evidence that a certain promotion by authors really does work.
Some years ago I mentioned on a reading list the difficulty of wading through the sea of m/m novels, paper and ebook. I’d managed to stumble over some pretty awful stuff and just figured that was the norm. Mark Zubro seemed to be the writer that kept coming up on Amazon as a clever writer. I found him lacking.
I hadn’t heard of Josh until he kindly sent me an e-copy of his first Adrien English novel. A bell went off in my head. *This* was what I’d been looking for, hoping for – a wonderful plot, endearing, sometimes flawed characters, interesting supporting cast, wit, suspense, clever dialogue.
Since then I’ve purchased all but one of Josh Lanyon’s novels and short stories. If I hadn’t received that free read, I would be out some pretty wonderful reading experiences. In fact, I found out about Wave’s fabulous website from his Facebook page. And since *then* I’ve read SO many great novels from recommendations and reviews on this website. Domino effect. 🙂
Now THAT’S the kind of story I like to read. 😀
Thank you for that, MaDonna.
I continue to give away lots and lots of books. I know many authors worry about this, worry about lost sales, but as marketing tools go, that’s been an effective one for me.
Great post, Josh, as usual. These are some of the topics I’ve been writing about and discussing recently with readers and other authors on my LiveJournal and Facebook, so it’s nice to see them addressed so well and in such detail by an author whose opinion is well respected.
With so many books published each day now, reviews from people one trusts are the main source of book recommendations, according a poll I did last year. Knowing which reviews are real is now more important than ever. Whether it’s one author putting down another, or reviewers who revel in the nasty put-down, I’m appalled at the direction many reviews are going. I see even readers taking pot-shots at authors, rather than just saying “not my cup of tea,” and being mean almost for the sake of it.
Some reviewers do it for the audience and attention, not for the joy of reading and sharing a review and their opinions. I do think some readers can end up shunning a book unnecessarily because of overly harsh and sarcastic reviews. That’s great power for the reviewer but it can really hurt an author who may not deserve. Some do, but even 3-star reviews are getting nasty. If you hate a book, just give it 1 star and leave it at that. No need to make personal jabs at the writer, publisher or editor.
I’ve also written recently about other bad promo behavior by authors, not all of them newbies, and I still stand by my observation that readers buy books of authors who they can like and respect based on online presence and interaction. The easiest way to kill sales is to act like a d-bag in public, especially to readers or other writers. The golden rule is alive and well, and as you say, it may take time, but good writing and being nice say a lot more about you than any review or bogus award.
Thanks for starting a great dialogue on the issues!
Hi EM
You make an excellent point about bad behaviour turning off readers. As you may know, we do surveys on the site and one that was done over a year ago was on whether an author’s bad behaviour affected the buying patterns of readers. When the results were tabluated –
46% of those surveyed said that they had dropped an author and stopped reading their books due to rudeness or other unacceptable behaviour.
37% of the group surveyed said they were more likely to try new authors based on how they interacted with them.
Only 15% said that an author’s online interaction didn’t affect them.
So how an author conducts himself or herself does have an effect on book sales and negates all of the time and effort spent on online promos.
Excellent comment, EM.
Reviewers like all writers, build a following, and inevitably they feel the same pressure we all do to perform.
They want to keep it lively, fresh, original — I mean, that’s the content that keeps readers coming back for more — and so some of them succumb to the temptation of cheap shots and unfair conclusions.
Once upon a time, and not in this genre, I used to write the funniest, snarkiest, and (I think) brutally accurate reviews around.
I wasn’t doing it for promotion because I didn’t intend to publish under my name. I had been published years before but I’d quit writing. I see now that I was reviewing as many frustrated writers do–in an unconscious gestation period of analysis and criticism.
Anyway, I developed a nice little following, and I would stretch to be funnier, cleverer, more insightful — but it’s easier to be all those things in a critical review than a positive review, and so I wrote a lot more scathing reviews than I did gushing.
Well, heck, I did want to be taken seriously! And I did very much value my opinion. (And God knows I still do.)
One day I got a letter from a quite well-known writer who I’d taken to task in a very funny (if I do say so myself) review. I brushed it off, wrote him a patronizing little note to the effect of if you can’t take the heat, get out of the kitchen.
I was working for the good of my genre!!!
😀
All I can say is time and experience have tempered my views. And I do, very frankly, value the feelings of people — especially those I consider friends — over my own exalted opinions.
Josh, you are the voice of sanity and reason (and a wonderful writer too). 🙂
I’m a newbie author (so new my first book is still at the proofreading stage) and I’ve only been exposed to other authors and various forums for a couple of months.
At first I was excited to be published but as time wore on I found some of the forums and the comments and apparent practices to be a little disillusioning. It kind of spoiled things for me for a while.
Now I’ve stepped back. I’ve stopped reading the forums every day which has funnily enough, given me time to write again. I couldn’t seem to manage both, yet I felt that I should be able to do it. All the other writers seemed to manage.
I have your book on writing m/m fiction and whenever I start to panic I go back to it. It’s full of excellent advice on writing AND how to stay sane once published.
Thanks for that.
Congratulations on your impending first publication! You made a great point about having more time to write when you aren’t all over the networking sites.
You’ll discover that the most prolific and more-established writers aren’t online that much, except in a few meaningful ways. They are busy writing, not talking about writing or reading other people talking about writing. It’s a bit more important when you’re starting out to make some friends and give people a chance to get to know you, but overall, spending time writing is the best investment in your future. I say that as someone who has learned the hard way that you can’t really do it all unless you don’t sleep. 😀
“… spending time writing is the best investment in your future.”
Very good advice. Thank you.
Hi Pender!
Congratulations on your upcoming book!
One of the most difficult aspects of a writing career is finding the balance of promotion and writing. And things like Twitter (which I love though I can’t seem to find time to post right now) and Facebook can easily eat up hours and hours of your day and your writing.
I wish I could say that promotion wasn’t necessary, but it is. But the single best promotion for any author is a brilliant backlist. Some authors misunderstand that advice and set about cranking out books as fast as possible. What you need to do is crank out QUALITY books as fast as possible, and fast and quality are not always a harmonious mix.
My rule of thumb for new authors is 3 things of promotion a day. Maybe you post to Facebook, maybe you do a guest blog, maybe you comment here at Wave’s (which is a high visibility site) and then you spend the rest of your time working on your writing and building that backlist.
That keeps you clear of trouble while building the best promo tool known to man: a quality backlist.
Thanks for commenting — I’m glad the book has proved useful!
Thanks, Josh. I was worried about the writing/promo ratio dilemma, wondering how I could manage both while working full time.
Then I realized if I don’t take the time to write I won’t have anything to promote. 🙂
Thanks for your comments it’s good to know I’m on the right track.
Wow – I had suspicions that some of this sort of thing must be going on, but I find myself wondering how on earth other writers find the time? I find it hard enough to make time for the writing bit, which has got to be far more important.
I have had other newbie writers offer me free copies of their stories – possibly because I review stories I enjoy. After one bad experience I decided to turn them down. I’m not going to write a glowing review for something I didn’t really enjoy, just because a friend wrote it. I need my self respect…
The time to give friends your forthright and honest opinion is BEFORE the book comes out. Once the book is out, there’s nothing your friend can do but weather the reaction. The role of a friend–I’ve always thought–is that of loyalty and support.
Honesty when and where it will do some good, yes, but if it’s past the point of rescue, then my job is to be there to offer the shoulder to cry on.
JL– The time to give friends your forthright and honest opinion is BEFORE the book comes out. Once the book is out, there’s nothing your friend can do but weather the reaction. The role of a friend–I’ve always thought–is that of loyalty and support.
NK– Yes, yes, a thousand times yes. But that gets into the synergistic interaction between writers, which, I think, is motivated from some different place than reviews–maybe compassion combined with intellectual curiosity. Possibly a compunction for compulsive problem solving as well. But mostly from the genuine desire for your friend to do well.
Yes, and if someone asks for my honest opinion, they’re always going to get it.
Nor do I pull punches with the books sent to me for evaluation — I hope I’m not unkind, but the point is to help the writer write the best possible book and get it published.
Sometimes, though, you don’t want honesty, you just want someone to share a bottle of wine and make sympathetic noises at all the right times.
I say that as someone who has learned the hard way that you can’t really do it all unless you don’t sleep.
This becomes my new – and heartfelt – strap line :). Thanks for the great article and discussion, Josh!
Clare, as you may recall (from a discussion on a publishers author group), you were one of my “role models” for how to balance writing with online time. I noticed new writers spending hours there chatting with each other, while the well-known and well-respected authors spent their time writing or interacting with readers in public fora, with their few posts being particularly useful and relevant.
I’m not saying to not interact with other writers, but the key to a wide readership is writing more. Readers can’t read it if you haven’t written it yet.
I honestly think that one reason new authors spend so much time talking to each other is because it’s safer. It’s sticking to your little clique.
We talk about how readers are intimidated by authors, but authors are equally nervous about readers. After all, we’re trying to sell our most precious commodity to you. This isn’t like selling a pair of shoes, this is personal, private stuff…even if it’s written for public consumption it’s part of us in a way selling you a car can’t be.
And while you readers see one author, we see a wall of mostly unknown READERS. (That should be in squiggly letters.)
Good point EM (and thanks for the compliment, though nowadays I’m dropping more spinning plates than I used to…:)).
But it’s true – there’s only a finite amount of time in the day (except in fiction) and it’s a continuing challenge to get the balance right. It depends to what extent you’re looking for friendship or approbation or sales – or all of them :).
Spending some of this precious writing time in haranguing others in the community seems a horrible waste, if you ask me.
And now we have proof as to why your inner 4 year old and your work shouldn’t mix.
As a (naive I guess) reader I have to admit that I’m still staring stupidly at the monitor thinking authors REALLY do that. For real? In real life, not in a comedy fiction novel?
That sounds scary. Especially since I tend to relay on reviews for choosing what to buy. I guess I’ll have to read the really great ones, and the awful ones twice from now on.
Also, the Golden Café Speckled Trout award? LOL How did you come up with that one? It’s a good thing I’m not an author because I’d be embarrassed to admit I won a speckled trout for my literary efforts.
Hey, I treasure my speckled trout! 😀
As a matter of fact, I treasure any and all reader awards because I know they’re the real thing. That’s the satisfaction of not trying to manipulate the ratings.
One other thought on why I love Amazon reviews is because they are informal reviews, you’ll sometimes get a reviwer who has spoken to the author and relates that information, or the author or someone who knows the author will even comment on a review to clarify a point — or there are discussions of the books on the book page at the bottom — so all those things are unique and make for an added element to those informal reviews that you just couldn’t get from a formal review.
My point being that you need BOTH.
hey. need to up my stalker points. 😀
there are so many pitfalls… oh god yes. i think you got to all of them. and god, what about the… as an author, can you have an opinion about another’s book (bad or good) and say it out loud?
and yes, i need to find the shift key. i do.
Hey there, Reece. I think we’ve pretty well covered that one in the million comment section. ;-P
Conclusion? Um…maybe.
Hey love.
This was very well thought out and written. I enjoy how you can deconstruct a situation. I think it’s an incredible talent.
Hi Josh (and Wave),
I was very fortunate in finding a couple of really class acts in the genre who took me under their wing prior to my even being published. While I haven’t had a completely trip-free path, I’ve managed to avoid most of the pitfalls of promo and networking over the past couple years due either to them sending a quick “um, don’t go there” email to me, or to playing by the Golden Rule.
I’m trying at this point in my career to now do the same for a few other newish authors, as well as for “my” authors in my job as editor.
Pay it forward. 🙂
Thanks for the great article, Josh. You are also a true class act.
Thanks for commenting, Devon. I think your experience is far more likely to be the norm. I think most writers are willing to help someone new to the ranks.
I think most of us see ourselves as part of a community rather than competitors in a race to the death.
(scrapes jaw off floor) That was an eye-opener, Josh! Crikey. As you know, I’m way too thick to conduct my own promo even along ethical lines, so I don’t think I’ll ever tumble into into the dreadful Grimpen Mire you’ve just opened up to me, but… Gosh. That was horribly, horribly interesting. Thank you, I think. 😀 xxx
See, there are more advantages to being a recluse than you imagined! 😀
Yep, I think I’ll stick to Craggy Island with the seagulls and the moss!
Excellent post, as usual. Sorry I’m late. I’ve been thinking a lot about reviewing recently because I think there might be among new writers a fundamental confusion between reviewing and literary criticism. The way I see it, the purpose of a review is advertising–fundamentally a Consumer Reports-style product overview that helps people decide how to spend their moneys, whereas literary criticism seeks to explore an authors work as a piece of art.
I think when new writers have the urge to review other writers (especially critically) they might be thinking that they are participating in a kind of open intellectual critical discourse and while that does occur between writers it doesn’t occur on public forums, but in private emails… or in the bar, over drinks, possibly with tissues handy.
I fully understand the hunger to talk writing–to say to an author, “Hey, I know where that story is weak and here’s one suggestion on how to fix it,” but that’s only really useful before said story is published as you pointed out earlier.
I realize this is a little sidestep from Authors Behaving Badly, but I do think that some bad behavior might actually be motivated by a genuine, though perhaps ill-conceived, desire to connect.
As an editor, though, I can confirm that I do, in fact, googlestalk potential authors to see how they behave online. Partially I do this to see if they have any kind of tact or promotional savvy, but mostly I do it to see how they react to criticism in order to try and predict what it might be like to work with them. If an author posts crazy screeds or badmouths her peers it’s a good bet that she’ll probably badmouth me too and I kinda don’t need that–not even if she’s a total genius with a book that will sell zillions. There’s just not enough mylanta in the world to convince me to endure that kind of stress.
That’s a great point. As an editor, I also cyber-screen potential authors before offering them a contract, and I know many other editors who do so as well. Something else to keep in mind when putting yourself out there. And even established authors can eventually be in the position of looking for a new pub house, so this is not just for the newbies to consider.
As a matter of fact, experienced authors are far more likely to be the ones looking for new publishers.
Meaning newbie authors are usually just abjectly grateful to be published.
It’s more likely the old pro who’ll be getting restless and start looking to upgrade. And, as Nikki said, troubled geniuses are equally likely to end in ulcers and $$$$. Who wants to take a chance on crazy when it could just as easily come stalking after you. 🙂
devonrhodes: “cyber-screen”
NK: Yeah, that’s definitely a better term to use than “googlestalk.” I’m going to add it to my vocabulary. 🙂
Yes! Absolutely. I do think this is true. And I agree with your comparison of review versus literary criticism.
You can’t ever underestimate the power of fiction and storytelling — disappointed readers do often react in anger just as delighted readers react with those heart-warming effusions. In most cases it’s simply an expression of the power of fiction in our lives.
And, yes, I’ve read reviews that felt to me like an attempt to open a dialog with an author…it would be good to know what Author X meant by…or If author X is listening maybe she can answer…
The problem there, as you point out, is the choice of venue. I’ll answer anything (writing-related) in a private email or in an Amazon discussion thread or on my personal Goodreads discussion list, but I’m not going to debate the merits of my work with a reviewer in an open forum. Because that’s what it feels like: debate.
Even if the reviewer does truly hope for some kind of open exchange, as so many here have reiterated, responding to reviews is always a mistake. I don’t even like to see those gracious-thru-gritted-teeth thank yous from authors to reviewers who’ve shredded them. The longer I go in this business, the more convinced I am that there needs to be a friendly but professional distance between reviewers and authors.
Just healthier for all concerned.
And I do agree that a good many writers reviewing other writers do NOT intend to hurt, they even hope to be helpful. I certainly think all my advice is helpful. ;-P
Josh
This post is so revealing on all levels. I am learning more and more every day. Don’t know what I’ll do with all this knowledge but I’m sure I’ll come up with a way to use it. 🙂 Did I pay you for being our Contributing Author? If not, the cheque is in the mail.
I’m so glad I’m not an author – I couldn’t stand the stress.
Well, it’s not like it doesn’t have its perks, Wave.
I guess what it gets down to is it’s a job just like any other. It has its stresses and strains and it has its Employee of the Month days complete with paper crown.
We don’t always get paid commensurate with the work with put in, others are sometimes promoted over our heads, our performance review is not always fair, and office politics are alive and well.
But we get paid for doing what we love, we generally make our own hours, we’re told by strangers that our work helps get them through their bad days, we make intense and lasting friendships–and sometimes we do get paid quite well.
In fact, somehow getting paid to write always feels like getting paid well.
This has been a fascinating discussion all round. I know when I first sold, I was writing reviews and was disappointed to realize I was going to have to stop. Not because anyone told me to, but because it felt uncomfortable to continue.
I, well, my alter ego, still writes about books, but they’re not reviews as such. I write about books I’ve enjoyed reading and try to persuade others to try them because I think the books were really good. But I don’t write about every such book, because sometimes I can’t convey what I liked in an interesting way.
And I focus on what worked for me. I don’t say that despite workmanlike, almost clunky prose the story rose above that with its fresh ideas and world-building. I don’t say the book’s ending was a hot mess but the first two thirds were worth the price of admission. When I reviewed, I would have.
I remain scared of Facebook (as an author, I have a personal page) so I haven’t been able to forcefeed my page on anyone. Yet.
This sort of thing can be a good compromise for a writer who loves to review but is no longer comfortable doing so.
And it’s a wonderfully effective promotional and networking tool because it’s unsolicited and sincere.
When two authors get together to write each other glowing reviews…that’s cynical. It’s not *always* a cardinal sin and I don’t want to make too much of what is sometimes a couple of authors just fooling around and having fun. I’m not trying to turn into the Review Police here. But as an ongoing strategy for success–you write me a rave review and I write you a rave review–it’s cynical in its attempt to manipulate the system.
But an appreciation from one author to another — very often an author who doesn’t know and has never spoken to the other–is a different thing altogether.
We authors are readers too. We’re fans of other authors. So writing something sincere and complimentary about another author’s work gives you something to talk about, tells YOUR readers something about your thoughts on writing and gives them insight into you from another angle, and should that other author come across your kind words, sometimes lead to friendships or at least add someone to your network.
A great deal of a successful writing career comes down to networking. Which is why you don’t want to burn bridges you don’t have to burn. And you want to establish connections beyond your own tight little circle.
Anyway, Joley first came to my attention with a nice review she’d written. After that I remembered her name and whenever I saw her mentioned I put in a good word. Did any of that do her any good? I have no idea, but my own experience is I’d rather people think positive thoughts when they see my name than think…oh, THAT asshole.